Nice. Thanks!
Some questions about the board-game rules
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Hello to everyone,
I and my friends just played Axis&Allies-Revides for the 4th time, and the game ist still rocking :evil:! We are alle convinced to keep WW2 going for many more evenings, the game really kicks ass :roll:!
But nethertheless, we had a few arguments about gaps in the rule book, or just rules that may be understood in different ways. It’s also possible, that we misunderstood or didn’t even recognize some sentences that could have answered one or two questions. To our defense: English is not our mother tongue over here in Germany, and all of us were burning to start playing while we quick-read the rule book.
Okay, here we go:
1. If the Soviet Union got “Mobile Industry” as their national ability, can the SU-Player move his industry-complexes even out of the red territory? For instance into conquered ex-German territory or maybe also into Sinkiang? In case he is allowed to, what happens if the SU-Player moves a complex into allied territory (for example Sinkiang)? Is it him or the allied nation who is able to use this complex for production? (ehm, yes, I know the history background to this NA, but the rule book is not saying that industrial complexes may only be moved into the eastern soviet territories :roll:)
2. If there is only one sea zone between to areas, units may be “bridged” over transports located in that specific sea zone. But how fast are units “bridged”, especially infantry? Do they need one or two turns to enter the opposite coast?
3. If ships, carriers and some airplanes (coming from land) attack a sea zone with some enemy ships in it and win the fight, may the airplanes fly back to an inland territory (if they have move points left) or are they forced to land on the carriers involved in the battle (unless they are not destroyed)?
4. Can submarines attack airplanes generally (I don’t talk about the prefight torpedo attack)? And does it work the other way round?
5. I really don’t think so, but some friends persist on that one: If you have two anti-aircraft-cannons in one territory, can they both fire on attacking airplanes?
6. And: Can an anti-aircraft-gun fire on attacking airplanes only once, before the first round of combat, or every time a new round of combat begins (unless the attacker retreats)?
7. How does a fight submarine vs. submarine work? The rule book says, that this kind of combat is treated like a combat between two normal ships. Does this mean every submarine has a prefight-torpedo-attack or none of both?
8. Does moving a unit onto a transport cost one of the units move-points? And, the other way round, can a transport move through two sea zones AND unload its units or does that recommends another move point of the transport?
9. The rule-book says that the Soviet NA “Russian Winter” may only be used once. But isn’t it a little bit weak then?
That is it so far.
I would really appreciate you for answering these few questions :) . I’m sure nearly all of you know the answers!
Thank you and best regards, Reign_of_Light
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i won’t hit them all as i’m not 100% sure on all of them.
first thing though get your hands on the new rules set and toss the book. i will look for the link to them after i post.edit: as promised, hear they are. use these rules as they are widlly regarded by most players as the rules to use. they also fix a lot of balance issues.
http://www.daak.de/indexe.php?sprache=e
http://www.axisandallies.org/LHTR2: if you are making an amphibous attack (sea attack) you can load troops of any type, move transport and unload all troops into battle.
if you are not attacking, you can do the same in non combat. so in effect infantry and artillary can load and unload the same turn. tanks don’t get any extra moves though.3: you can land your plains any place they can reach not just the carrier.
4: subs can not (forget history) hit a plain under any surcumstance.
5: no, you can have 50 AA’guns, but only one shoots at each plain. 50 plains= 50 shots. 1 plain=1 shot no amount of AA’s above 1 change this.
6: pre battle only. this is the same for a Battle ship on the amphibious landing. one shot then it’s done.
7: both get there pre fight attack. think of it as if you had a transport with both. subs attack. then remove casulties, then normal combat. treat the battle as if you had other non destroyer ships.
8: load troops, move transport up to 2 spots then unload. all can be done in one turn. i always unload if i can to be safe. nothing worse then getting a transport sunk fully loaded.
9: sure is. thats what house rules are for. the NA only buys USSR one turn. it serves it’s job in that regard as the Allies have time on there side with this one.
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Welcome, Reign_of_Light!
I’ll add to some of Pervavita’s answers:
1. If the Soviet Union got “Mobile Industry” as their national ability, can the SU-Player move his industry-complexes even out of the red territory? For instance into conquered ex-German territory or maybe also into Sinkiang? In case he is allowed to, what happens if the SU-Player moves a complex into allied territory (for example Sinkiang)? Is it him or the allied nation who is able to use this complex for production? (ehm, yes, I know the history background to this NA, but the rule book is not saying that industrial complexes may only be moved into the eastern soviet territories :roll:)
The Soviet player can move the complex into any territory he or she controls, but not into a territory controlled by an ally.
4. Can submarines attack airplanes generally (I don’t talk about the prefight torpedo attack)? And does it work the other way round?
4: subs can not (forget history) hit a plain under any surcumstance.
But air units can attack subs.
8. Does moving a unit onto a transport cost one of the units move-points? And, the other way round, can a transport move through two sea zones AND unload its units or does that recommends another move point of the transport?
8: load troops, move transport up to 2 spots then unload. all can be done in one turn. i always unload if i can to be safe. nothing worse then getting a transport sunk fully loaded.
However, loading and/or unloading uses a land unit’s full movement for the turn. It may not move before loading or after unloading.
Enjoy the game!
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:-)
I think that they have answered all your questions fairly well, so all I wish to add is that this game is easy to learn how to play, but will take many many games to master it. If you can play chess, monopoly, risk, and deplomacy, all at the same time, then this is your game! Remember, this is a game, not a reinactment of, (a diplomatic-military) history. Trying to play historically is not advised, if you really want to win that is.
But as you already have found out, it is fun and addictive!
Good hunting, and good luck!
Crazy Ivan :-o -
I think of it more as Risk, Craps and Poker all at once…
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Hello to everyone,
I and my friends just played Axis&Allies-Revides for the 4th time, and the game ist still rocking :evil:! We are alle convinced to keep WW2 going for many more evenings, the game really kicks a** :roll:!
But nethertheless, we had a few arguments about gaps in the rule book, or just rules that may be understood in different ways. It’s also possible, that we misunderstood or didn’t even recognize some sentences that could have answered one or two questions. To our defense: English is not our mother tongue over here in Germany, and all of us were burning to start playing while we quick-read the rule book.
Have you tried looking for DAAK? They’re a German site for Axis and Allies.
Okay, here we go:
1. If the Soviet Union got “Mobile Industry” as their national ability, can the SU-Player move his industry-complexes even out of the red territory? For instance into conquered ex-German territory or maybe also into Sinkiang? In case he is allowed to, what happens if the SU-Player moves a complex into allied territory (for example Sinkiang)? Is it him or the allied nation who is able to use this complex for production? (ehm, yes, I know the history background to this NA, but the rule book is not saying that industrial complexes may only be moved into the eastern soviet territories :roll:)
Yes, you can move industrial complexes out of red territories However, you cannot move an industrial complex into enemy territory (the move is during the noncombat phase). The FAQ (on the Avalon Hill/Wizards website) states that you can only USE the Russian industrial complex if you owned both the industrial complex AND the territory into which you moved the industrial complex at the start of the turn.
Example: Let us say that your Russian industrial complex is at Novosibirsk and Sinkiang is controlled by the Americans. You move your Russian industrial complex into Sinkiang. You did not own Sinkiang since the beginning of the turn, so you cannot place any Russian units there.
If Sinkiang is captured by the Japanese, the industrial complex becomes a Japanese industrial complex.
If Sinkiang is re-captured by the Russians, the industrial complex becomes a Russian industrial complex (pg 18), even though the Americans control the territory. The industrial complex cannot move that turn, as it was involved in combat. It can move in later turns. The Americans cannot build an industrial complex in Sinkaing until the Russians move their industrial complex out.
If Sinkiang is re-captured by the Americans, the industrial complex becomes an American industrial complex.
2. If there is only one sea zone between to areas, units may be “bridged” over transports located in that specific sea zone. But how fast are units “bridged”, especially infantry? Do they need one or two turns to enter the opposite coast?
You can load a unit then offload it in the same turn.
Example - Say you have four Japanese transports east of Japan in sea zone 60 (I believe it is). Russia controls Burytia. During the combat move phase, you use your four Japanese transports to pick up six Japanese infantry and two Japanese tanks from Japan. The four Japanese transports unload the six Japanese infantry and two Japanese tanks into Burytia. After carrying out combat, you do your noncombat phase.
3. If ships, carriers and some airplanes (coming from land) attack a sea zone with some enemy ships in it and win the fight, may the airplanes fly back to an inland territory (if they have move points left) or are they forced to land on the carriers involved in the battle (unless they are not destroyed)?
Fighters may fly back to inland territories if they have move points left, or they may land on carriers. You can choose which you want after combat ends. Bombers must fly back to a land territory as bombers cannot land on carriers, and a bomber could not attack if it couldn’t land in the first place.
4. Can submarines attack airplanes generally (I don’t talk about the prefight torpedo attack)? And does it work the other way round?
A submarine can never hit a fighter or bomber under any circumstances. A fighter or bomber can hit a sub.
5. I really don’t think so, but some friends persist on that one: If you have two anti-aircraft-cannons in one territory, can they both fire on attacking airplanes?
Pg. 13, “only one antiaircraft gun per territory can fire”. If the Russians have an antiaircraft gun in Karelia, and the UK has an antiaircraft gun in Karelia, and the Americans have an antiaircraft gun in Karelia, a German fighter that flies over Karelia will still only get shot at by one antiaircraft gun.
6. And: Can an anti-aircraft-gun fire on attacking airplanes only once, before the first round of combat, or every time a new round of combat begins (unless the attacker retreats)?
Antiaircraft guns fire on attacking airplanes only once, during the opening fire round of the first round of combat. After the antiaircraft gun fires once at each attacking fighter and once at each attacking bomber, the AA gun does nothing for the rest of that combat.
Note that battleships provide a support shot if they are in the same zone as a transport unloading into hostile territory, and there was no combat in that sea zone that turn. This is also a one-time attack during the opening fire round of the first round of combat.
Subs fire in the opening fire round in EVERY round of combat.
7. How does a fight submarine vs. submarine work? The rule book says, that this kind of combat is treated like a combat between two normal ships. Does this mean every submarine has a prefight-torpedo-attack or none of both?
No, the combat is NOT really treated like a combat between two normal ships.
First, the attacking submarines fire during the opening fire round of combat. This is NOT the regular fire round, but the opening fire round.
Then, the defender chooses casualties.
Then, the defending submarines fire during the opening fire round of combat. This is NOT the regular fire round, but the opening fire round.
Then the attacker chooses casualties.
Then the regular fire round is carried out (submarines do not fire during this round)
Then attackers can choose to submerge or retreat, and defenders can choose to submerge.
8. Does moving a unit onto a transport cost one of the units move-points? And, the other way round, can a transport move through two sea zones AND unload its units or does that recommends another move point of the transport?
Moving a unit onto a transport costs no move points. A transport can move two sea zones and unload its units. A transport can pick up a unit, move one sea zone, pick up another unit, move another sea zone, then unload both units it picked up.
However, note that if you load a land unit onto a transport, you cannot have moved that land unit other than to put it on the transport. If there is an infantry in Karelia and a transport northwest of Norway, you cannot move the infantry from Karelia into Norway, then pick up the infantry with the transport. Nor could you do it if it were a tank. The transport has to be in a sea zone adjacent to the land territory that contains the land unit you want to pick up.
Also note that if you unload a land unit, you cannot move that land unit after it unloads. So if you unload a tank into Norway, it stays in Norway. The tank cannot move to Karelia that turn.
9. The rule-book says that the Soviet NA “Russian Winter” may only be used once. But isn’t it a little bit weak then?
Better than nothing. Anyways, you shouldn’t use NAs. They are far too good for the Allies. If you MUST use NAs, I recommend you use the LHTR version (Larry Harris Tournament Rule); I noted other people put the link up in this thread. But if you DO use LHTR, note there are a few OTHER changes to the rules as well.
That is it so far.
I would really appreciate you for answering these few questions :) . I’m sure nearly all of you know the answers!
Thank you and best regards, Reign_of_Light
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Maybe I missed it above, but I’d like to point out another point about the Mobile Industry ability:
Yes, you MAY move it out of Red territories into captured ENEMY territories. (it must have a Russian flag or be a Russian start territory) However, to build there you MUST have owned the territory at the START of your turn. That’s pretty darn important, IMHO.
BTW, some tactics I’ve seen for this:
1) Move your ICs to Yakut/SFE before they are captured. This makes them virtually useless to the enemy (and easier for America to liberate later, btw.)
2) Stack your ICs in Moscow to prevent Germany from getting them in Caucasus
3) Walk an IC with the main body of your army everywhere it goes.
Furthermore, many of us have considered that Mobile Industry also gets the Russian Rail benefit like AA Guns, Infantry and Artillery.
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Hello again,
thank you so much for all your answers. I have to confess we decided on most rules exactly wrong :roll: . For example: Our defending Anti-aircraft guns always shot in every(!) opening fire round, again and again. Seemed to be realistic, because there was no logical reason to us why an anti-aircraft-gun should stop firing on attacking airplanes?!
Our submarines were even real “super-units” being able to shoot down airplanes. The top of it: We made submarines shoot two times in a round: In the opening fire phase AND again in normal combat. Therefore they got only one(!) opening fire, cause we supposed them to be located by every enemy ship after their “surprise-attack”. Now I’m asking myself (and of course you) whether submarines are attackable by battleships, transport and carriers at all if they are not guarded by a destroyer?
As you see, even your additional comments, that did not really belong to any question of mine, helped us a lot with some surprising realizations :-D !I have one important question left. The last 3 (of 4) times we played axis&allies-revised the axis won the war (Okay, last time it was an absolutly impossible amount of luck when the weaker Japanese fleet won over my American navy, that was nearly two times as big; they even kept two battleships :x ; Nevertheless even my victory wouldn’t necessarily have saved Moskau from the Germans.). Next Sunday we Allies (I love the challange) will try again (this time using massive amounts of bombers for the first time, maybe we underestimated them 'til now). But for the case that the allies loose again, I started to read about the whole “bidding” thing. I was really surprised when I realized, that people are bidding for the Axis(!) and not for the Allies that seem weaker to me. Additionally I read in many threads that in most cases the Axis win over the Allies (what proves my experiences). So can you tell me why you bid for the Axis instead of the Allies in A&A-Revised :? ?
[Edit]Ah, before I forget: Can you please list all units that cannot attack or defend each other? For example: can infantry defend against airplanes?
[Edit2] Last question for today ;) : Is the number of fighters per carrier limited?
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So can you tell me why you bid for the Axis instead of the Allies in A&A-Revised :? ?
The Allies have the economical and positional advantage. The Axis have the tactical advantage due to their starting units. I haven’t played that many games by myself, but I noticed that it is easier for me to play the axis because they have a clear goal and that is moskow. With the Allies I am not that good because they have so many possibilities and they have to work together much more so than the Axis. But as far as I know the games between good players favour the Allies therefore the bid has been developed. If your group think the Axis have the edge, then maybe you should start bidding for them with time and more games to be played you may come around.
[Edit]Ah, before I forget: Can you please list all units that cannot attack or defend each other? For example: can infantry defend against airplanes?
Air can attack everything and can be attacked by everything except subs.
No land unit can attack sea units. But BB and DD (with the appropiate tech) can attack land units in landing operations (but only once before the normal combat is resolved! Any casualties do not participate in the normal combat)[Edit2] Last question for today ;) : Is the number of fighters per carrier limited?
There can be only 2 figs on 1 carrier (or less).
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Thank you for answering my questions :-) !
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