Hey, guys,
could someone be havin’ fun with our lack of edykashun?
It took F_k to catch him!

Well, I guess I’ll go make trouble somewhars. :P - Xi

yea according to Guderian which i agree with tottaly if the Hamass attack military Targets they would be Revolutionaries not terrorists. if they were to do that instead of the Terrorism, allot of ynaks would support the palestinians, and the European States would back them allot. plus they wouldnt be veiwd as evil peps by the world

I was refering to Palestine as the rejoin, aka present day Israel. Not just refering to the specific roman provinces.

@DasEwokSS:

yea according to Guderian which i agree with tottaly if the Hamass attack military Targets they would be Revolutionaries not terrorists. if they were to do that instead of the Terrorism, allot of ynaks would support the palestinians, and the European States would back them allot. plus they wouldnt be veiwd as evil peps by the world

i don’t know about that.
If the Montana militia (or some such group of maniacs - real or fictitious) attacked and blew up an American army base, killing all personal at said army base, this would be seen as a military and non-evil act? Kind of like Pearl Harbour i guess, eh?
Obviously i disagree. Yeah Mr. Ghoul, you’re right - military people are trained and apprised of many of their risks. All the same i have trouble with what i would consider to be terrorist activities on these people. I mean, if they were shooting at me, then yeah, i’d try to defend myself, but the idea of some guy blowing up a whack of unsuspecting people who happen to be dressed in green is nearly as much an anathema to me as the one destroying a bunch of non-green dressers.

I’m more in line with CC, though even the Israel military is not without its share of “terrorist” acts.

I’m not saying the Palestinians are perfect. I think Arafat’s a fool and a liar. However, Arafat is not Palestine. Hamas is not Palestine. The Palestinians are a group of people who are constantly being controlled by others. By Israel, by Arafat, by terrorist groups. Give them a chance to control themselves. Israel has not given them this chance, and has no intention of giving it to them. Israel is happy with it’s imperialistic hold over the West Bank and Gaza, and thats the problem.

D_E_S, I concur.

Y dude,
I disagree. Israel has seen the Palestinians manipulated and controlled by others each time Israel relaxes controls. Therefore, they find Israeli control the lesser of a half dozen evils.

“We brought destruction upon the [Palestinian] refugees,
by calling on them to leave their homes.”

• Khaled Al-Azam, Syrian Prime Minister in 1949 (memoirs, 1973)

“The Jews haven’t attacked any Arab village, unless attacked first.”

• Ismayil Safwat, Commander of Palestinian Operations, March, 1948.

“Communism is inequality, but not as property is.
Property is exploitation of the weak by the strong.
Communism is exploitation of the strong by the weak.”

• Pierre-Joseph Proudhon

And thats why the terrorism continues. For Israel, the control is the lesser of two evils. For the Palestinians, the control is 10x worse than what they receive from the Terrorists or Arafat.

I’d like to see all you Israeli supporters under 24 hour curfew.

“Communism is inequality, but not as property is.
Property is exploitation of the weak by the strong.
Communism is exploitation of the strong by the weak.”

• Pierre-Joseph Proudhon

Wrong, wrong, wrong! In communism, not everything is equal as some people’s needs are greater than others (ex. great amount of labor). Also by exploting the strong by the communist government, you are setting yourself up to another national democratic bourgeois revolution, resulting in Stalinism.

Heres how I can see a communism working.

1. Democracy, I think everyone agrees with me here.
2. Choice. The economy is not ENTIRELY state run. You decide your career
3. Education. Everyone gets a free, college, and high level education.
4. Time. It takes patience to set this up, quite in contrast to the Bolsheveiks.

4. Time. It takes patience to set this up, quite in contrast to the Bolsheveiks

This was not so much of a problem but to modernize and remove Russia from it’s isolated, undeveloped past. Bolsheveiks knew that if gains were not made fast (in productivity), they would leave themselves open to the counterattack of the capitalist and the increasing needs of the peasantry and the proletariat.

Choice. The economy is not ENTIRELY state run. You decide your career

The people are the state. You should be able to decide your career, though that does not mean you’ll always achieve it.

T_6,
Please, don’t get so bent out of shape about these quotes. They are views and definitions of the Russian Communist system. And I begin to see that they were right.
After all, and here comes a great Xiuote :P ,

" The problem with all governments, religions, political
and economic systems is that people are involved." - Xi

or

" The problem with all human relationships
is that people are involved." - Xi

“Today’s Communism can survive
only if it abandons the myth
of an infallible party,
if it continues to think,
and if it becomes democratic.”

• Friedrich Dürrenmatt, Swiss essayist.

Please, don’t get so bent out of shape about these quotes. They are views and definitions of the Russian Communist system. And I begin to see that they were right.

From where? Books written by the capitalist? Sure they must be “fact.” After all, look at all their holdings, their paychecks, their life – they must know everything! Please capitalist, take advantage of us! Lets not think for ourselves… :o

" The problem with all governments, religions, political
and economic systems is that people are involved."

Faulty products often make for faulty people and vice versa.

“Today’s Communism can survive
only if it abandons the myth
of an infallible party,
if it continues to think,
and if it becomes democratic.”

• Friedrich Dürrenmatt, Swiss essayist.

WRONG!!! If you bothered to look up the movement of communist today, there is no “myth” of one, single infallible party. People are free to choose their own party and their own beliefs. But if the capitalists attack, we will defend ourselves and our system.

_6,
These quotes were from 1947 to the 1990’s. Some were by ‘born and died capitalists’ while others were by ‘Russian born Communists turned seekers’(again, please note, NOT TRUE COMMUNISTS). Keep it in context. :P

I go huntin’ with buckshot, accidentally :) shoot my neighbor’s cow, and he comes after me with a tactical nuke. :wink: - Xi

@F_alk:

@General:

Sorry, now I will try mein English!

Guderian, try a different translation program. The german text was without meaning. And don’t pretend you will “try” english, when you tried german ;)

i still find this really amusing. I went back to re-read the original quote, and now i can’t take it seriously at all. Am i the only one with this problem? Mind you, i guess Xi and TG’s arguments over quotes belittles the intent of the original post, so i guess that’s appropriate :)

The whole Guderian quote seems to be one piece of a puzzle.
It seems to have been pulled from somewhere else.

@General:

. . . terrorists will target and attack civilians if it serves
a political purpose. Revolutionaries attack military
targets. Classification of political groups into revolu-
tionary or terrorist labels is a matter of identifying
who was attacked and why.
-Guderian

However, wouldn’t the above quotette :) make the French and
Russian Revolutions terrorist acts to a degree? The aristocrates
lost a lot in these revolutions.
…food for thought.

Uh oh! :oops: Here we go again! - Xi

“One of the striking differences between Fascism and Communism
is this: Fascism has inspired no great work of art… No doubt,
Fascism is too vile and scurrilous an ideology to produce those
charities of the imagination which are essential to literate art.
Communism, even when it has gone venomous, is a mythology of the
human future, a vision of human possibility rich in moral demand.
Fascism is the ultimate code of the hoodlum; Communism fails
because it would seek to impose upon the fragile plurality of
human nature and conduct an artificial ideal of self-denial and
human purpose. Fascism tyrannizes through contempt of man;
Communism tyrannizes by exalting man above that sphere of private
error, private ambition, and private love which we call freedom.”

• George Steiner, French–born U.S. critic.
  “The Writer and Communism,” Language and Silence(1967).

i still find this really amusing. I went back to re-read the original quote, and now i can’t take it seriously at all. Am i the only one with this problem?

Hahaha… as F_alk would say, your German is very bad.

Mind you, i guess Xi and TG’s arguments over quotes belittles the intent of the original post, so i guess that’s appropriate

When I see a quote that I find inappropriate, I will deal with it. Us Americans don’t give up that easy.

“One of the striking differences between Fascism and Communism
is this: Fascism has inspired no great work of art…. No doubt,
Fascism is too vile and scurrilous an ideology to produce those
charities of the imagination which are essential to literate art.
Communism, even when it has gone venomous, is a mythology of the
human future, a vision of human possibility rich in moral demand.
Fascism is the ultimate code of the hoodlum; Communism fails
because it would seek to impose upon the fragile plurality of
human nature and conduct an artificial ideal of self-denial and
human purpose. Fascism tyrannizes through contempt of man;
Communism tyrannizes by exalting man above that sphere of private
error, private ambition, and private love which we call freedom.”

Hahaha, I think DasEwokSS would disagree with you on fascism (thank you for knowing the correct spelling).
Myths don’t come true, Communism will. There is no human purpose under communism? Give me a break. It would seem like it would have a more “humane” purpose. Be careful with human nature - it will surprise you. Also, Communism is freedom - compare that spectrum with fascism to see why.