I still think Subs vs planes should be improve, here is a less radical way.
Planes should be able to hit subs anytime they don’t submerge.
Subs on defence should be able to escape destroyers (in an other way than sinking all attacking DDs).
Subs should be used anytime (even when no DD is present) as sea-fodder casualties against planes to protect more important vessels.
If I kept the more important aspects of my last post:
1a) Planes only (without DD) can attack subs only naval group (or with transport) A@1.
c) After first round attack, all surviving subs can submerge in the same sea-zone.
2a) When planes only (without DD) attacks Subs+ other warships, Fg A3 StB A4, as OOB
b) However, the defender can now choose to sink Subs instead of surface vessel (contrary to OOB).
But, to do it, the defender must announce at the start of the first round that his subs are not submerging.
c)
d) After the first round, all subs can still submerge (as in OOB Sub Surprise Phase).
3a) When planes and other warships (without DD) attacks Subs only, all planes A@1.
b) All subs rolls, as OOB, a surprise defense strike @1 or can elect to submerge in the same SZ.
c) If Subs elect to submerge instead, only planes can attack @1 and it is played as in 1a above.
4a) When DD is present, all is played as OOB except all defending Subs can submerge after first round.
Subs on offence cannot hit planes.
But when there is only defending planes (against subs+ warships/planes), subs can be chosen as casualties (contrary to OOB).
I think it is also possible to consider subs vs planes in the opposite way:
Planes cannot hit any subs (even when DD is on their side) if their is any other elligible casualties. (Said otherwise, Subs are chosen last by planes.)
So, in any battle of planes (+ other type of units) vs subs+warships, the presence/absence of destroyer will not change the way the subs casualties can be picked against owner’s unit.
Planes will be mostly against surface vessels,
surface vessels can hit both planes, warships and subs,
and subs can hit any ships but no plane.
Still as OOB, planes needs DD to attack subs.
DD works as OOB for everything else except:
Even when attacking DD is present, all defending Subs which survived can submerge after first round attack, and on any other round.
It may includes this addendum: “… instead of having their defensive roll @1”
Of course, all destroyed Subs have a defense roll @1.
Uncrustable,
why don’t use this game mechanics instead when attacking transports?
@Baron:
@Baron:
@Uncrustable:
Transports cost reduced to 6 IPCs.
-When empty may move 3 spaces during noncombat move. No transport may move 4 spaces
-Transport ‘evasive maneuvers’, each transport caught undefended by an attacking warship or plane may roll 1 dice. A roll of a 1 is a successful evasive maneuver and that transport is removed from battle and placed back on the game board, a transport that evaded an enemy attack while undefended may not unload units until its next turn.This is another way to play a defenseless transport which should be added in this thread to be complete on the optional rule for this topic.
It makes me think about a similar but still a bit different way to played it also as a defenseless but not hopeless transport:
When there is no more warships/aircrafts to defend transports, then each transport roll and for each “1” rolled in a specific round, one TT can escape.
Attacker need to hit transport unit according to each attacking factor (ex.: subs @2/ DD @2 / CA @3, etc.) to destroy one transport.
Each round any un-destroyed transport which haven’t been able to escape can still trying to roll “1” to escape.The combat end when, either all remaining transports have been able to escape, or have been destroyed.
Their will be no more auto-die, no combat unit will be destroy and the naval combat is done according to usual A&A system rule: a roll is needed to destroy any unit and no unit able to destroy more than 1 unit in the same combat round.
Since I play-tested it,
I say it is much more interesting than auto-die and more balance way to keep some surviving TT than destroying expensive attacking units (one way or an other).I should add this detail:
transport can get their evasive roll as soon as their is no more warships or planes on their side at the end of a combat round.Always attacking units can hit first, and it is only surviving transport which can get an evasive roll.
Which means, for instance, if their is 2 transports at the beginning of a round and 2 are hitten by attacker’s units then their is no evasive roll.
