UK barbarossa strategies

[Cow]

One does not need Calcutta to win the game.  A combined Axis threat on Russia is usually enough to stop the Allies from winning - however, the necessity is to stop Allied air from getting to Moscow and to do that, you need the norther Russian territories, for at least a turn.  20-26 ground units in Nentsia is pretty significant, with Italy going for Ukraine and Germany focusing on Baltic/E. Poland area, the Russians are split two ways without any way for the Allies to realistically send help (come on, you cannot both hold India AND send reinforcements from there.)  Add in Japanese streaming through China and it’s pretty much a done deal for Russia.

YAWN GERMANY AND JAPAN VS RUSSIA IS SO 2 MONTHS AGO. It does fail pretty hard, two reasons, cough calcutta making 27… what is the point of taking out russia if you got another wall of infantry to deal with before egypt? dutch islands are done japan is screwed. burma road and china is lame. everyday usa is shuffling, that is how that game goes. Either that 2 anzac fighters fly into russia every turn along with a bunch of allies junk.

Japan not blowing up on his side of the board is just dumb. Everyone knows how that game goes. Honestly the whole japan vs russia thing is only viable when russia leaves a mid size to all his infantry in amur on russia 1, where all your air is in range to hit it on J1.

[Alsch91]

Agreed.

Jen, if you’re sending the brunt of Japan’s resources against Russia, and US goes KJF, then of course Axis will win.
That’s a huge rookie mistake to make.
If Axis is clearly going for the Europe win, then you go KGF.  Duh.

[Cow]

^^^^^^^^

you could also do KJF and race. The calcutta infantry is many and can wall off egypt. germany vs everyone doesn’t work out either. Full atlantic is much safer if Japan is going russia as UK pac, ANZAC, and china will have a bigger bankroll than japan, which is just sad.

Still I am not sure how this thread went from how UK handles barb to different axis strategies, honestly G2 full transport buy and romania major factory is sub optimal for doing barb. This has been explained thoroughly in other threads.

The whole point of the changes was to balance the game so countries do their objectives and both axis and allies have a fair shot at winning the game. Before the AA gun rule changes came in, you couldn’t find an allies player without giving him at least 4-6 infantry on UK.

[Jennifer]

@Alsch91:

Oh please.

If Germany’s dropping that kind of force in northern Russia and buying 10 transports on G2, Russia will be making all sorts of bank in Europe. � Stacked up in Hungary/Romania, with planes and mobile forces falling back to stem your advance from the north.

You may think, however, one forgets, Russia doesn’t have that much to begin with while Germany easily has 170 IPC on the first three rounds (Compared to 90 IPC for Russia).  Meanwhile, a gelded England is still rebuilding and not threatening, America’s way too far away to field more than a single transport - maybe two for harrassment.  Italy’s mostly unopposed in Africa - usually is when England think’s its getting invaded.

I find Russia is usually crushed to at least 2 or 3 territories before Germany has to move units to block the British/Americans.

And yes, as I mentioned earlier, Japan’s sending it all against Russia and to hell with America.  America will still have to dedicate about 5 rounds to the Pacific (7 if they split) and that’s 5 (7) rounds of no harrassment to Germany.  IF the goal is win on the Europe map, what does it matter what you do or dont have in the Pacific?  Hell, I might (MIGHT) even recommend not taking any of the DEI so America cannot get them either. Â

As for Calcutta, anyone stupid enough to let them make more than 17 is an obvious ametuer at the game.  Sorry, but seriously, other than the first round or two, there’s no legitimate reason they shouldn’t be down to max 12 IPC a round.  Why don’t you have 2 or 3 submarines CRDing them with a moderately good Japanese fleet in the DEI?  I mean common, it’s not THAT hard.  Hell, Larry gave you everything you needed at the start of the game, you dont even need to build anything!  (You should, but you dont HAVE TOO.)

Only thing that should push Japan back is America, and the only reason you allow that is so they are not investing in the Atlantic.  Remember, your goal is to win on Europe, not Pacific.  That means there is only one VC on the Pacific map you have to care about: Tokyo.  Everything else is tertiary at best.  Even China can be mostly left alone once your army is past them, fine, let them liberate.  Better still, INVITE the Vodka swilling bastards into Manchuria, you have any idea how helpful that is to Germany?  18 less hits, 36 less punch PER ROUND on the attack on Moscow!

I think your problem is you are still stuck in this globalization strategy of Classic, Revised and Anniversary and are not thinking in the mono-board mindset the Axis really need to win in 1940.   Who cares what you have on the board you dont want to win on, hell, even avoiding taking things works out on that board.  There have been plenty of games where I ignored Africa because I wanted to win in the Pacific.  America couldn’t get the French or British territories there because I never took them, so they quickly lost the money needed to stop Germany AND Japan.  Likewise, lull the Americans into thinking an easy win (there’s no way they are taking Tokyo before round 10, even if you do nothing to stop them but build for a couple rounds there) meanwhile, strip them of what they need to stop Germany from winning. Â

Stop thinking mono-laterally.  This is a two sided campaign, you need EITHER Germany OR Japan, you do not need both.

[Cow]

You are thinking mono laterally. Alsch91 is more experienced than you IMHO. Miss I have yet to play a game of the new version.

Also I still can’t believe you found allies players to play against in the old +3, I almost always had to give them 4-6 infantry for UK. Plus I wouldn’t want to play axis without giving allies stuff back then, that is just boring, I may as well proclaim victory and walk out the room.

J3 DOW is full of fail, this is not just me saying this, but almost everyone agrees. UK pac and ANZAC combined making more than Japan is just stupid.

Your campaign does not end at russia, there is a reason why japan has to take out calcutta… that is a wall of infantry before your last VC which is egypt unless you want to do late game london with America being RIGHT THERE.

Larry Harris balanced the game so at some point doing objectives is a wise idea. Maybe the reason people play global instead of europe is because japan plays like Japan and not like a sidekick against russia so the game is balanced against that.

Cmdr Jennifer you offer no original or unique idea that has not been done and we are telling you how it goes. You played an imbalanced version that almost always led to axis victory without giving allies any form of bid, that is not a good example of experience.

I am more impressed by axis players who give their opponents bids for allies and walk out with the W. I am not impressed by your performance.

Whenever I am axis I give the allies a small bid. Personally I enjoy winning in the Pacific more than I do winning in Europe, Germany just so happens to win in Europe on his own… but I am more proud of the pacific wins I have under my belt against full pacific USA with 18 russians taking korea and manchuria and marching down. These were glorious wins, Germany taking Russia is like being proud of what is supposed to happen every game.

[Jennifer]

Oh that’s easy, America’s not an issue for most of the game - as you two said, they’re exploiting the fact Japan’s suckering them in, on the Pacific side.  They’re WELL accounted for.

As for getting players for the Allies, it was easy with the rule that Germany couldnt take London before Round 5.  Had lots of people flock there, and mostly, if I went Barbarossa, they died anyway.  Even with 10 transports.  Russia’s still WAY underpowered, and with the end run, they don’t make hardly anything anyway.  Usually cap Moscow around turn 8, which gives me 2 or 3 full rounds before a really set up America can hit me.  By then, I have 28-42 armor running full steam for Egypt to secure it once and for all.

[Cow]

you know, germany not taking london before round 5 is not the same as a bid -.-  I am not impressed by your performance. Also russia did not have the cannon fodder it has now (4 aa guns as casualties). The cannon fodder does make a big difference early on.

Jen you went from complaining about axis not being compensated for the london buff and now you are saying russia is underpowered. -.- Make up your mind woman.

[Cow]

This thread is about UK, not about you and your axis in a game that does not exist anymore.

I cannot be mad at your japan play, I can only be disappointed. I will never play a multi with you on my team as japan. Your japan is a sad panda.

Russians will always make 24 minimal with just russia alone +african NO income. Any form of stall from the allies screws you up. It helps if Japan is actively going for a pacific win so less stuff can stall germany from taking russia.

Plus it takes 4 rounds to get from russia to egypt with mech/tanks.

I am sorry jen the game has evolved. Please do not offer advice to Larry Harris, the community as a whole has brought about these changes which you have forsaken for your own selfish reasons. If you don’t want to play japan, play the europe half only.

Honestly I do feel russia’s big income bonus from africa being paramount to allies strategy and success is kind of disappointing, but it does prevent your game style from being the most optimal strategy.

It is one of the biggest complaints people have about allies, is that they have no other alternative than to get Russia NOs from Africa.

F it, give russia a bomber and 6 more infantry and drop the NO.

Jen the lowest you can make russia is 24, unless italy or japan does some form of africa play. If you put all your eggs in one basket, you just end up getting stalled. The Russian NO does keep the axis honest and playing for their objectives so I understand why Larry Harris made these changes.

In revised and aa50 he was a little disappointed in the lack of pacific play and japan spamming tanks to move toward russia. LH expressed these grievances many times.

[Cow]

Back to the topic.

Yes UK should take the medit sea very seriously. Avoid taking ethiopia somalia tobruk and libya. Kill the units but do not take the territory. Have russia move in with a mech or tank to take the territory and then reinforce him. Russia needs these bonuses to his income.

Convoy disrupt 97 and shut italy out of the game is a top priority for UK, this prevents any chance of italy doing any future african play, because he will have 0 income to do so. fly air into russia as necessary. Russia will always make at the minimal 8 infantry as long as he has original italy territories.

Load a russian unit onto a UK transport when you can. USA bombs italy’s airbase. Drop russian mech in siciliy and sardinia for +6 more russian income.

FULL CHEESE REMEMBER FULL CHEESE. Russia will never go below 30 ipc at this point and will make 10 infantry a round no matter what, FULL CHEESE REMEMBER FULL CHEESE.

If axis want to play dirty, you must play dirtier, get greasy slimy and wet off sardines.
~
Cheese forever until russia gets the 2 destroyers 2 cruiser and transport he deserves in the black sea, the russian bomber he deserves, and 1 infantry for bryansk smolensk rostov tambov and archangel

FULL CHEESE UNTIL WE GET WHAT WE WANT WITH RUSSIA FROM LARRY HARRIS!

[questioneer]

Well look at what we have here…2 arrogant blabbers blowing their breath with no substance at all.

Both of you shut up and play a game against one another- maybe a best of 3 or 5 to settle it.

Talk, talk, talk…I guess that’s what forums are only good for.

I think I’d like to pop some corn and watch you two blowholes go at it- entertaining…fire up the TripleA!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Cow]

THE TOPIC IS NOW HOW TO BEST GET UNITED KINGDOM TO HELP CHEESE FOR RUSSIA’S NATIONAL OBJECTIVE MONEY OFF OF ORIGINAL ITALIAN TERRITORIES.

[questioneer]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Jennifer]

@questioneer:

Well look at what we have here…2 arrogant blabbers blowing their breath with no substance at all.

Both of you shut up and play a game against one another- maybe a best of 3 or 5 to settle it.

Talk, talk, talk…I guess that’s what forums are only good for.Â

I think I’d like to pop some corn and watch you two blowholes go at it- entertaining…fire up the TripleA!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Battlemap.  That way I know there were no games played with the TripleA dicey.  :P

Anyway, I think I just proved my point in a game on the forums.  England’s in too much dissarray to bloody well cook dinner, let alone fight the Japs or the Germs.  Australia’s fleetless and cannot have any of their NOs.  China’s obliterated, they have 2 infantry and 3 territories left, America’s split between two decisions - let the German’s win, or let the Japanese win.

Anyway, England, as I see it, still has the same basic choice, albeit, they have quite a bit more drama there for Germany to deal with (in case of Sea Lion.)  Either call Germany’s bluff and go whole hog for Africa/Med to neuter Italy (that still has not had their fleet combined so they have a prayer of a chance in the Med) or abandon the world and assure victory in London.  I suspect, if Germany has more than 7 transports in SZ 112/110 or 113, England’s going to run for home and hide behind their Scotish Skirts (sure…call them Kilts.)

[Noll]

TripleA dices can’t be manipulated, and you get mailed the dice results for every roll. That’s a good thing.

[Cow]

UK usually sinks sz 97 at 84%~ odds. 1 fighter 1 bomber off of uk comes down. the gib cruiser and fighter kills the lone destroyer. naval from egypt slam bb cruiser (and 3 fighters should you scramble).

If you sink 109 instead of 110, different allies players may have different responses in this scenario. Some may merge their fleet others may still do the same attack.

Merge is safer (as 2 air units are in range of UK from carrier and more air can be kept home).

Attacking is still a viable option. Both options are good calls that depend on player preference IMHO. Attacking usually results in Italy starting at 4 different fleets and having to decide which to kill. If germany does not sink anything, usually italy loses his last transport to naval + bomber + malta fighters if in range.

[theROCmonster]

I agree with COW. Russia needs A LOT of help. At least 6 more units. Would like seeing 1 tank 1 mech 1 art 3 infantry added at the least. Never seen Russia hold, and I only attack Russia with Germany. Too damn easy to just roll through Russia with no problem. Can’t stand it!

[Jennifer]

COW: If England attacks SZ 97, yes.  I sometimes lament Larry split the Italains even more, instead of consolidating them more, but it is what it is.

theROC: Exactly why you need to land in Northern Russia.  Check it, from Scotland (the closer of the two Englands) no fighters can get to Russia if you have Karelia, Leningrad, Arkhanglesk and Nenetsia.  That means they have to go:
A) Be Built
B) Fly to Africa
C) Fly to Alexandria / Sea
D. Fly to Persia
E) Fly to Moscow

That is a bit longer than England > Scotland > Nenetsia (or similar) > Mowscow and the psychological effect cannot be discounted either.

[Jennifer]

@Noll:

TripleA dices can’t be manipulated, and you get mailed the dice results for every roll. That’s a good thing.

It might be difficult, but as long as it’s a computer running the dice, it can always be manipulated.  Top that off with the first versions that could handle Revised literally getting whacko dice, it just makes me hesitant to use it. At least until I get my new computer going, install the software and play with it for a month recording dice results to ensure AA Guns get 15-19% hit ratios (it should be 17%)

I know the house dicey is pretty accurate, but I’ve been using it since forever.  FOE’s was as well, so is Frood’s calculator.  I didn’t rely on ANY of them without first testing them out.  It’s nothing personal, I just don’t want to fly 5 American Bombers over Berlin and have all 5 shot down by an AA Gun (Well, can’t anymore, limit 3, but you get the idea) when it should only be 1.  I used to get similar to that all the time in TripleA and Dogs of War.

[Cow]

triple a dice comes from a server unless you are using the internal roller (which is for solo games).

If bombers are doing air runs, the AA gun is not what shoots at them, the complex itself has a built in Anti Air system (means you don’t need to keep AA guns on your capital to prevent industrial bombing).

[theROCmonster]

So my question is where do we go from here on Russia? Because frankly I am tired of playing as the allies and just seeing russia so screwed so fast. Nothing he can do about it. At least in the other games of axis and allies a good Russian player could hold out for 10-20 rounds.