New AA gun rule (Dual Trained Flak Crews)

[ghr2]

I just had an interesting idea for another use for the aa gun.  Whether this can be a tech, nation specific advantage, or all over change, it does not matter to me.  Dual Trained Flak Crews would be like aa shots, against tanks aswell.  Basically, when the attacker finishes declaring combat, and the combat starts, where you would normally roll aa gun shots, make it so that the defender can choose to dedicate how many aa guns to anti tank duty, and how many to anti air duty.  Then the anti tank is rolled the exact same way the anti air is rolled.  Tanks that are hit are taken out of combat just how air would be taken out (Maybe we can also allow mechs to be targets aswell, dont know).  This may add more tension and risk involved for people who mass just a butt ton of tanks and (maybe) mechs.  The realism is that german 88mm anti-air crews were also trained for an anti tank role should it be necessary.  (they were given like telescopic sights and anti tank rounds as well as their normal Anti-Air setup).

Thoughts?

Has this been tried/proposed before?

[Hobbes]

@ghr2:

I just had an interesting idea for another use for the aa gun.  Whether this can be a tech, nation specific advantage, or all over change, it does not matter to me.  Dual Trained Flak Crews would be like aa shots, against tanks aswell.  Basically, when the attacker finishes declaring combat, and the combat starts, where you would normally roll aa gun shots, make it so that the defender can choose to dedicate how many aa guns to anti tank duty, and how many to anti air duty.  Then the anti tank is rolled the exact same way the anti air is rolled.  Tanks that are hit are taken out of combat just how air would be taken out (Maybe we can also allow mechs to be targets aswell, dont know).  This may add more tension and risk involved for people who mass just a butt ton of tanks and (maybe) mechs.  The realism is that german 88mm anti-air crews were also trained for an anti tank role should it be necessary.  (they were given like telescopic sights and anti tank rounds as well as their normal Anti-Air setup).

Thoughts?

Has this been tried/proposed before?

Yes. On the World at War expansion for A&A. The rule was that each AA could fire at 3 units, either planes or armor and you could have more than 1 AA per territory but each enemy unit could only be targeted by 1 AA. AAs also fired at the same time as all other units and you could take them as losses.

[ghr2]

Ya, I was trying for a g40 version of the rule.

[Tall Paul]

I might be badly mistaken, and I haven’t re-read the rules to check, but I thought you were limited to only ONE A/A Gun in each teritory.

“Tall Paul”

[ghr2]

Technically, I do not see any rules where you can’t.  In Alpha 3, you absolutely can have more than 1.

[Tall Paul]

GHR2,

Well, let’s see. A&A 1940-Europe, page 26, A/A Guns, 3rd paragraph. “Only ONE A/A Gun can fire in a battle, no matter how many are in the teritory (and even if the others are controlled by different powers)”.

Of course, you’re talking about “House Rules”, so you’re not necessarily bound by this rule.

Interesting idea, although HBG is already building
Tank Destroyers in all of their Supplement Sets just to fill this purpose. And I’d imagine they will end up having a dual-purpose A/D value.

“Tall Paul”

[ghr2]

@Tall:

GHR2,

Well, let’s see. A&A 1940-Europe, page 26, A/A Guns, 3rd paragraph. “Only ONE A/A Gun can fire in a battle, no matter how many are in the teritory (and even if the others are controlled by different powers)”.

Of course, you’re talking about “House Rules”, so you’re not necessarily bound by this rule.

Interesting idea, although HBG is already building
Tank Destroyers in all of their Supplement Sets just to fill this purpose. And I’d imagine they will end up having a dual-purpose A/D value.

“Tall Paul”

AA Guns:
Cost: 5 Attack: - Defense: - Move: 1
Unit Characteristics
Limited Move: Normally this unit can be moved only during the Noncombat Move phase. This unit cannot move during the Combat Move phase (other than being carried on a transport if the unit was loaded on a prior turn).

No Combat Value: Even though an AA gun can defend, either alone or with other units, it has a combat value of 0. This means that an AA gun cannot fire in the defending units fire step. It can, however, be taken as a casualty. If a territory containing AA guns and no combat units is attacked, the AA guns are automatically destroyed. AA guns may never attack.

Air Defense: AA guns can only fire at an air unit when that unit attacks the territory containing that AA gun. AA guns fire only once, before the first round of combat. Each AA gun in the territory may fire up to three times, but only once per attacking air unit. In other words, the total number of air defense dice rolled is three times the number of AA guns, or the number of attacking air units, whichever is the lesser. Once the number of air defense dice is determined, the dice are rolled. For each “1” rolled, the attacker must choose one air unit as a casualty. These casualties are removed immediately, and will not participate in the remainder of the battle. This AA gun attack is made immediately before normal combat occurs in the territory containing the AA gun. AA guns do not defend facilities against strategic or tactical bombing. Facilities have their own “built in” air defenses.

Alpha 3 tab from http://www.harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=6149

I think I win sir

[ghr2]

Also, it works for non Alpha 3 since you can use just the 1 aa gun anyways and it fires a shot for all targets there is.

[Tall Paul]

It wasn’t a “contest” of any kind.

I simply don’t see that this rule is necesary, especially with the new units now being produced.

To each his own, though. Have FUN should always be our #1 rule. Enjoy.

“Tall Paul”