USSR Baltic Navy?

[kcdzim]

@calvinhobbesliker:

My rationalization is that those ships impose a blockade that prevents the people from getting food; thus the ipc’s are wasted on buying more food than on war

But again, that would apply only to island nations.  Germany and Russia weren’t importing food across the Baltic.  Australia, the US, Germany and Russia would be largely self sufficient as their bread baskets and agricultural centers would be located on the continent.  I could see the blockade applying that way for Britain and Japan, although I thought Japan was also fairly self sufficient with food, it was the problem in reverse - failure to safely send food to the pacific islands caused famine.  It might be argued that ipcs are wasted that way, but to me that seems like the point of interdiction on the islands, not Japan proper.  Britain however did need food aid, yes.

[calvinhobbesliker]

@kcdzim:

@calvinhobbesliker:

My rationalization is that those ships impose a blockade that prevents the people from getting food; thus the ipc’s are wasted on buying more food than on war

But again, that would apply only to island nations.  Germany and Russia weren’t importing food across the Baltic.  Australia, the US, Germany and Russia would be largely self sufficient as their bread baskets and agricultural centers would be located on the continent.  I could see the blockade applying that way for Britain and Japan, although I thought Japan was also fairly self sufficient with food, it was the problem in reverse - failure to safely send food to the pacific islands caused famine.  It might be argued that ipcs are wasted that way, but to me that seems like the point of interdiction on the islands, not Japan proper.  Britain however did need food aid, yes.

Yes, the American continent has food, but much of it comes from oversees. If it’s blockaded, ipc’s have to be spent to make it up

[Funcioneta]

Probably there will be a convoy next to Germany. It has sense losing IPCs if Germany has Norway but no land connection to it, but it has no sense losing IPCs if there is not a territory non-connected with the capital. At least with the current economic system, of course

Convoy boxes were a better system

[Gargantua]

Britain had a set tonnage, of transports sunk, that if reached, they would flat out surrender because they would starve.

The book reference is “Blood Tears and Folly”.

I beleive it was calculated monthly, and the number was 625,000 tonnes sunk = churchill surrenders.

Twice I think the Gerries claimed they were above 500,000. though it was probably more like 400,000.

I think 600,000 even if achieved, wouldn’t have garunteed the end. But England wouldn’t have lasted much longer before the public was screaming for an armistice.

So ABSOLUTELY. Convoys around an island capital, should be paramount.

[Make_It_Round]

The map detail and unit set-up are about 2x Anniversary scale in the '40 games…

Any guesses as to what the German navy in the baltic will look like?

(I’m thinking it’ll be 2x transports, 1x battleship, 1x cruiser, 1x destroyer 3x  subs or thereabouts.)

[WILD BILL]

Yea that sounds about right M I R. Maybe just 2 subs, and many others scattered in the Atlantic. Germany getting a BB is a no brainier, hope its there  :evil:

[allweneedislove]

@Make_It_Round:

It looks like the Baltic might get split into two sea zones on the new Europe '40 map.

If it does, there seems to be a good chance for the USSR to finally get some sea units to start off with in the northern Baltic. Destroying Russian sea units here was, historically, a priority in Operation Barbarossa.

What will these be? A destroyer+transport classic Axis bait set-up? Or something more substantial (cruiser) or sneaky (sub)?

assuming the euro game uses the same ratios as the pacific game then ussr navy will be the following

USSR’s game navy: 0 battleships, 0 cruisers, 2 destroyers, 0 carriers, 2 subs
i do not know how transports were calculated for the game so can not make an estimate
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=18414.0

historicly ussr navy was split between the baltic, black sea, and barents sea. i am guessing that the ussr will not have any navy in the baltic to start the game.

[allweneedislove]

@Make_It_Round:

The map detail and unit set-up are about 2x Anniversary scale in the '40 games…

Any guesses as to what the German navy in the baltic will look like?

(I’m thinking it’ll be 2x transports, 1x battleship, 1x cruiser, 1x destroyer 3x  subs or thereabouts.)

germany’s entire euro navy should look like the following.

Germany’s game navy: 1 battleship, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer, 0 carriers, 7 subs
i do not know how transports were calculated for the game so can not make an estimate
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=18414.0

your guess as to what would be in the baltic looks good, but will be almost the entire g navy

[almashir]

If the Russians have a convoy marker on the map, it will probably be in the Arctic Ocean (Arkangelsk) instead of the Baltic.  Historically, they had a fleet consisting of a couple of old battlecruisers and assorted cruisers, destroyers, and subs trapped in Leningrad.  The Germans did worry that they might try to set sail, but it would probably have been suicide against the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe.  The Russians used them as artillery to help defend the city while it was under siege.

[WILD BILL]

Well with the political rules Russia could start with a small navy in the Baltic (dd & sub maybe even a cruiser) and it could survive for 1-2 rounds. Ger and Russ start off as neutral to each other. They can pass through each others sz’s while neutral. Russia could leave the dd in the northern Baltic to keep Germany from using bombardment in an amphib when it does attack. It could also attempt to run from the Baltic to meet up w/UK navy before Germany attacks. If Russia is still neutral to Germany we know they can coexist in the same sz, will the Soviets be able to pass through the German owned Danish straight?