Love it!
11th Day of the 11th Month
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Columbus’ voyage has even less meaning for North Americans than for South Americans because Columbus never set foot on our continent, nor did he open it to European trade. Scandinavian Vikings already had settlements here in the eleventh century, and British fisherman probably fished the shores of Canada for decades before Columbus. The first European explorer to thoroughly document his visit to North America was the Italian explorer Giovanni Caboto, who sailed for England’s King Henry VII and became known by his anglicized name, John Cabot. Caboto arrived in 1497 and claimed North America for the English sovereign while Columbus was still searching for India in the Caribbean. After three voyages to America and more than a decade of study, Columbus still believed that Cuba was a part of the continent of Asia, South America was only an island, and the coast of Central America was close to the Ganges River.
Unable to celebrate Columbus’ exploration as a great discovery, some apologists now want to commemorate it as the great “cultural encounter.” Under this interpretation, Columbus becomes a sensitive genius thinking beyond his time in the passionate pursuit of knowledge and understanding. The historical record refutes this, too.
Contrary to popular legend, Columbus did not prove that the world was round; educated people had known that for centuries. The Egyptian-Greek scientist Erastosthenes, working for Alexandria and Aswan, already had measured the circumference and diameter of the world in the third century B.C. Arab scientists had developed a whole discipline of geography and measurement, and in the tenth century A.D., Al Maqdisi described the earth with 360 degrees of longitude and 180 degrees of latitude. .
You see, Jen. Despite what you learned in your third grade class, your Columbus is a sham. And as far as your insulting civil rights, I understand why you like your fairytale columbus so much.
and btw, Columbus captured more Indian slaves than he could transport to Spain in his small ships, he put them to work in mines and plantations which he, his family and followers created throughout the Caribbean. His marauding band hunted Indians for sport and profit - beating, raping, torturing, killing, and then using the Indian bodies as food for their hunting dogs.
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everyone owned slaves back then. even black people owned black people in africa. and they were treated just as bad. why single out columbus?
hell in the america’s the aztecs took 10,000’s of slaves every couple of years so they had enough slaves to cut their hearts out for sacrifice. so who’s worse. the native american indians owned slaves up until american expansion. are all these people also monsters then. does that fit into your mindview?
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Of course it does, bung. was I supposed to mention others? the subject was columbus. But sure they were savage murderers too. Happy? So since we all agree that columbus was a slave selling murderer, why do you want to have a day to …. as Jen puts it… “worship him”?
Hell,… since, Hitler expanded his German borders for a few years, wanna give him a day too?
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no.
countries have all sorts of holidays for people. columbus wansnt any more terrible than anybody else around the world at his time. so why not give him a day for getting the west to look west again.
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Fair enough, bung.
Personally, I don’t really care. I would rather have a Christopher Walken Day or a Sid Vicious Day. -
Yeah if they had actually supplied something to the American Culture that was more powerful then iconic only…
I like Christopher Walken Day, only though if he has to do his Stand Up Act on National Television. Then the day would be complete…
GG
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Actually, Stuka, Columbus discovering anything or not is not the point. The point is he was told the Earth was flat and he’d fall off the end of it if he tried to sail to the Indies in the wrong direction.
Despite the common knowledge of the day and all the “scientists” and religious fanatics telling him it was suicide, he had the testicular fortitude to say he was right and prove it by actively going out and doing it.
I don’t care if he liked to rape 3 year old boys with black skin and purple eyes. That’s not germane to the discussion! What matters is at least he was a scientist that was so sure of his convictions he was willing to put his own life in jeapordy to prove them true. That’s something our kids should look up too.
Being willing to stand up and speak without actually putting anything in jeapordy is no reason to revere someone. Who would give a rat’s pah-toot about Thomas Jefferson, Andrew Jackson, Robert E. Lee, Winston Churchill, Albert Einstein or Sir Isaac Newton if they only talked about what they thought was right and never acted on their beliefs? No one, that’s who. But because this guy was speaking out for someone’s rights (instead of actually fighting for them or getting elected and trying to get them legislation to protect them) he gets remembered? Sounds to me like this is a guy who had no real skills, so he swindled people into giving him money and power. In other words, a good scam artist, but not really someone I want my kids to revere as some hero.
If they need to revere someone who is not a politician nor a tactician, they can revere Paulo Freire who rose from poverty and re-engineered the school systems so that people of color and people of poverty could learn material in a manner they can understand instead of by rote memory. In other words, he is responsible for the severe reduction of the banking method of teaching.
Next time you think “Thank goodness I don’t have to memorize the national and state capitols of the world” remember Paulo Freire. Next time you are allowed to give your opinion on an exam essay and only back it up with your opinions, thank Paolo Freire. He focused on thinking skills, not memorization.
His birthday should be a day off. Not some frazzin upstart who incited riots and civil disobedience. (BTW, Paulo is not Caucasian, so don’t go off half cocked about some racist crap. I know that’s next, just disarming the fuse now.)
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everyone knew the world wasnt flat. they just didnt know what was over there, b/c such a journey couldnt be done until then. they needed better bigger boats which finally came around at the right time. and couragous guys, or in columbus’ case, mixed with opportunism b/c he’s down on his luck with finances.
but ask any sailor or navy person……everyone thats been on a ship in the middle of nowhere can tell you that the world is round b/c you can see it on the boat. look out to the horizon and you’ll see the earths curve.
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@Cmdr:
I don’t care if he liked to rape 3 year old boys with black skin and purple eyes. That’s not germane to the discussion! What matters is at least he was a scientist that was so sure of his convictions he was willing to put his own life in jeapordy to prove them true. That’s something our kids should look up too.
That’s beautiful. You’re kids will look up to a pedophile if he invented the longer lasting light bulb. If my mother demanded me to respect a rapist because he was some brave scientific guru, I’d slap the sh*t out of her.
But because this guy was speaking out for someone’s rights (instead of actually fighting for them or getting elected and trying to get them legislation to protect them) he gets remembered? Sounds to me like this is a guy who had no real skills, so he swindled people into giving him money and power. In other words, a good scam artist, but not really someone I want my kids to revere as some hero.
. Not some frazzin upstart who incited riots and civil disobedience. (BTW, Paulo is not Caucasian, so don’t go off half cocked about some racist crap. I know that’s next, just disarming the fuse now.)
I don’t have to…. you did enough yourself.
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@stuka:
@Cmdr:
I don’t care if he liked to rape 3 year old boys with black skin and purple eyes. That’s not germane to the discussion! What matters is at least he was a scientist that was so sure of his convictions he was willing to put his own life in jeapordy to prove them true. That’s something our kids should look up too.
That’s beautiful. You’re kids will look up to a pedophile if he invented the longer lasting light bulb. If my mother demanded me to respect a rapist because he was some brave scientific guru, I’d slap the sh*t out of her.
But because this guy was speaking out for someone’s rights (instead of actually fighting for them or getting elected and trying to get them legislation to protect them) he gets remembered? Sounds to me like this is a guy who had no real skills, so he swindled people into giving him money and power. In other words, a good scam artist, but not really someone I want my kids to revere as some hero.
. Not some frazzin upstart who incited riots and civil disobedience. (BTW, Paulo is not Caucasian, so don’t go off half cocked about some racist crap. I know that’s next, just disarming the fuse now.)
I don’t have to…. you did enough yourself.
Way to miss the point.
The lowliest private in the military has done more for this country then a civilian too cowardly to even run for office.
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Okay, let’s say for even the slightest moment, you’re correct and he should have run for office. This is to run for office in a nation which had a very serious civil rights problem. with black and white drinking fountains… hangings for looking at white women… threatened voting rights… having to give up a bus seat…
Yeah, sure… he’ll win. :roll:
Tell you what, Jen. Go and publicly speak your feelings at a local pub or a mall or write a column in a well read publication. See how many people share your feelings about MLK. Ask your congressman to make a statement saying, “We made a mistake giving MLK a day of rememberance.” Tell your black friends… (if you have any black friends :lol: :lol: :lol:)… what you told me. See first hand how he or she will react.
If you feel sooo strong about it… DO SOMETHING ABOUT. I would love to see it.
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