History following a common theme?

@yourbuttocks:

Its a little bit early to talk about the fall of the U.S. as a superpower. We haven’t even finished expanding. We’re kind of like Rome. We are starting out as a democracy, and we have done some expanding, to create a power base. We will continue expanding to unite North America as Rome united Italy, and then we will go to war with China and North Korea. China can’t stand up to as, If South Korea, Taiwan, and japan wanted to, they could probably take out China and they are our allies. We already have massive air power and a 500,000 standing army. With about a Million in reserve. Our forces are significantly more advanced and better trained than the Chinese. The South Koreans have a 600,000 man army, and Taiwan has a 400,000 man one. It wouldn’t take long for Japan to remilitarize, and for all four countries to call up our reserves. U.S. forces can spear head the assault while The Korean, Taiwanese, and Japanese forces can mainly occupy.

TO get them to help us we can promise Manchuria to Japan, North Korea to South Korea, and We can give Taiwan Kwatung. We can take the rest.

Please tell me this is something you are never hoping to see happen.
ugly.
And i would far rather see Canada join the EEU than the US.

I think China losing to anyone short of us is a bit extreme. Japan has no large standing army. Taiwan is just an insigificant little island. South Korea has an impressive army for her size, but nothing close to China’s. China has a potential 200,000,000 person army. If the US and China went to war, its doubtful we’d be able to do much to each other, unless it goes Nuclear. China would probably go after our allies in Asia, while the US would bomb major Chineese cities and military bases.

And I maintain, China is the only country who can detect our Stealth Bombers.

@Yanny:

I think China losing to anyone short of us is a bit extreme. Japan has no large standing army. Taiwan is just an insigificant little island. South Korea has an impressive army for her size, but nothing close to China’s. China has a potential 200,000,000 person army. If the US and China went to war, its doubtful we’d be able to do much to each other, unless it goes Nuclear. China would probably go after our allies in Asia, while the US would bomb major Chineese cities and military bases.

And I maintain, China is the only country who can detect our Stealth Bombers.

Chinese weapons are still behind the American weapons though, their only advantage is numbers. With a quarter of the world in their country, drawing reserves to fight SEATO would not be too hard for the country to do. Besides, Manchuria wants independence, it should get it. I don’t think the Japanese want Manchuria again, besides some nationalistic politicians. Their government is already in heavy debt. It’s also in their constitution nto to have too large of a military and they cannot own any atomic weapons, thanks to America.

Methinks EmuGod and FinsterniS need to consult.
E_G_ agreed with F_S, but the comments didn’t match.

And…

@yourbuttocks:

Its a little bit early to talk about the fall of the U.S. as a superpower. We haven’t even finished expanding. We’re kind of like Rome. We are starting out as a democracy, and we have done some expanding, to create a power base. We will continue expanding to unite North America as Rome united Italy, and then we will go to war with China and North Korea. China can’t stand up to as, If South Korea, Taiwan, and japan wanted to, they could probably take out China and they are our allies. We already have massive air power and a 500,000 standing army. With about a Million in reserve. Our forces are significantly more advanced and better trained than the Chinese. The South Koreans have a 600,000 man army, and Taiwan has a 400,000 man one. It wouldn’t take long for Japan to remilitarize, and for all four countries to call up our reserves. U.S. forces can spear head the assault while The Korean, Taiwanese, and Japanese forces can mainly occupy.

TO get them to help us we can promise Manchuria to Japan, North Korea to South Korea, and We can give Taiwan Kwatung. We can take the rest.

Sounds great! What universe is this in?

@cystic:

And i would far rather see Canada join the EEU than the US.

Nah, I think Canada will split up. Q’ebec will become New France, some territories will join the US, and a few will go it alone(preferring their own laws and US protection. :lol: :oops: No, I’m serious.
–----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
“I do believe in spoons! I do believe in spoons! I do believe, I do believe, I do believe in spoons!!” - A Famous Misquote

China would win a ground war. You cannot beat 200,000,000 moderately equipt soldiers. An invasion of China is impossible. The Manpower of over a billion people, we cannot combat that without going Nuclear.

China would probably gain from a war. You can expect South Korea to be quickly taken. Tawain won’t last long either. Japan might last awhile, but I can’t see their meagar defense forces putting up much of a fight. China would then likely expand into the south, cutting off all possible US bases. Again, it would end up going nuclear.

@Yanny:

China would win a ground war. You cannot beat 200,000,000 moderately equipt soldiers. An invasion of China is impossible. The Manpower of over a billion people, we cannot combat that without going Nuclear.

China would probably gain from a war. You can expect South Korea to be quickly taken. Tawain won’t last long either. Japan might last awhile, but I can’t see their meagar defense forces putting up much of a fight. China would then likely expand into the south, cutting off all possible US bases. Again, it would end up going nuclear.

Nah, Japan would hold out. You’re forgetting that its an island nation and that China would have to attempt the most difficult operation for any military - the amphibious assault. With modern equipment and quick mobiliziation by the US and other former SEATO members, Japan could fend off such an attac. The Chinese, even if they would succeed, would take massive casualties mounting such an attack and the chances of defeating the Japanese are very low. Don’t forget, the Japanese have a history of fighting ot the death. If they would do so, the Chinese would have to fight them city by city, street by street, and hosue by house. Tokyo is the largest city in the world, taking out all the Japanese there woudl cost China a lot of manpower. Taiwan would fall to the amphibious assault simply because it has inadequate defences to fend of China and that there are many people there that would welcome Chinese control. They would probalby cause coups as the Chinese army arrived, which would force the island quickly into Chiense control.

@EmuGod:

@Yanny:

China would win a ground war. You cannot beat 200,000,000 moderately equipt soldiers. An invasion of China is impossible. The Manpower of over a billion people, we cannot combat that without going Nuclear.

China would probably gain from a war. You can expect South Korea to be quickly taken. Tawain won’t last long either. Japan might last awhile, but I can’t see their meagar defense forces putting up much of a fight. China would then likely expand into the south, cutting off all possible US bases. Again, it would end up going nuclear.

Nah, Japan would hold out. You’re forgetting that its an island nation and that China would have to attempt the most difficult operation for any military - the amphibious assault. With modern equipment and quick mobiliziation by the US and other former SEATO members, Japan could fend off such an attac. The Chinese, even if they would succeed, would take massive casualties mounting such an attack and the chances of defeating the Japanese are very low. Don’t forget, the Japanese have a history of fighting ot the death. If they would do so, the Chinese would have to fight them city by city, street by street, and hosue by house. Tokyo is the largest city in the world, taking out all the Japanese there woudl cost China a lot of manpower. Taiwan would fall to the amphibious assault simply because it has inadequate defences to fend of China and that there are many people there that would welcome Chinese control. They would probalby cause coups as the Chinese army arrived, which would force the island quickly into Chiense control.

wrt Taiwan - This also depends on where the US navy is stationed at the time, as well as other factors.

True, but the Chinese have been preparing to invade Taiwan for a long time. Recently they’ve been practicing amphibious attacks just in case. I think it is pretty safe to say that they’d be able to take ove the island, but who knowsat what cost.

hey, interesting subject. I wrote a paper about this last year and according to my own conclusions the islamic world has a good chance to become the next dominating area of the world.

In my paper i noticed how the political importance of areas shifted throughout history, from the middle east (egypt, mesopotamia) to the mediterranean (rome, carthage), to northern europe in the late middle ages. These changes were caused mainly by the climate. But in the 20st century a new development takes place. The industrial revolution causes the US and Russia with their huge resources to become world powers. However i think the world is currently heading for a new direction. Its no longer human resources that really matter but oil and level of technology. From this point of view the middle east has a great potential and i think they are slowly becoming more important due to the iraq issue. US will remain a strong nation due to its oil reserves and technology. Russia lacks the technology. Europe has technology but is virtually dependant on oil resources from outside of europe. Europe is also by far a union and imo not subject to strong patriotic values. Only a war against a major power outside of europe is able to make europe a strong military power.

well said green slave. well ne way imo i beleive china can take taiwan as quik as Germany took Holland ;) no offense to ne dutchmen/women.

and inmo Japan would be hard as hell for the Chinese to take not to mention if they try to accomplish this, USA would send in the marines to help the Japanese defend Japan.

but if the Chinese succed in taking Japan. it would seriously hur the USA economy imo. which could be a major factor in a prolonged war. and if both side refusee to turn to Nukes, China always has South East china and Russia and the Middle East to expand to to get its resources. i mean Siberia has mass amounts of oil and resources if they were to fall into Chinese hands, :roll: sad to say that could be the begining of the end for the Nations agaisnt China.

as a matter of fact there coming out with a game called C&C Generals. its about USA ,China, GLA(Terrorists) it looks realley cool ;)

but ne back onto subject if Europe were to Unite and become morew RIght WIng i feel that they have a chance to become the Superpowers once again.

so thats my 2 cents ;)

im dutch :evil:

It will be harder to get taiwan though. They are prepared for an attack and its an island, im sure the americans will claim that taking some small islands can be just as hard as driving through europe to berlin.

The dutch were suprised by the blitzkrieg (we were planning on staying neutral and never feared an invasion). The germans allready took half our nation when the defences were formed (still disorganized). Then they landed behind our lines with parachutes, so we were stuck on a small piece of land. But we fought on bravely, then they bombed rotterdam to the ground with a lot of deads. Then we were forced to surrender.

thats great green sleeve ;)

@greensleeves_16:

im dutch :evil:

It will be harder to get taiwan though. They are prepared for an attack and its an island, im sure the americans will claim that taking some small islands can be just as hard as driving through europe to berlin.

The dutch were suprised by the blitzkrieg (we were planning on staying neutral and never feared an invasion). The germans allready took half our nation when the defences were formed (still disorganized). Then they landed behind our lines with parachutes, so we were stuck on a small piece of land. But we fought on bravely, then they bombed rotterdam to the ground with a lot of deads. Then we were forced to surrender.

I loved The Netherlands. One of my favorite countries - my uncle was the consulate there for (Den Hague) for many years, and we visited for a while. I loved (almost) everything about it - cept for the constant manure-y smell and the level of (non-violent) crime. I also love the relationship that exists between Canada and The Netherlands. It really feels great to be a Canadian there, especially knowing that we did something to help them (although i’m sure that any nations military assigned to that area would have done the same).
I also like its “socialist values” although i disagree (vehemeintly - sp?) with them at times.
And Amsterdam is cooler than Lisbon, IMO.

@greensleeves_16:

im dutch :evil:

It will be harder to get taiwan though. They are prepared for an attack and its an island, im sure the americans will claim that taking some small islands can be just as hard as driving through europe to berlin.

The dutch were suprised by the blitzkrieg (we were planning on staying neutral and never feared an invasion). The germans allready took half our nation when the defences were formed (still disorganized). Then they landed behind our lines with parachutes, so we were stuck on a small piece of land. But we fought on bravely, then they bombed rotterdam to the ground with a lot of deads. Then we were forced to surrender.

It wasn’t eactly a surprise. The Belgians had found out about the invasion of hte Low COuntries and had informed Holland of it, but I guess they still hoped to stay neutral till the end. Have you ever visited Anee Frank’s house In Amsterdam?

never been there.

The Netherlands never expected it, i wouldnt know if they were warned by belgium, probably so. The dutch people expected to be neutral again like in world war I, so there were virtually no worries about the upcoming danger, including politicians. But they should have learned from the poland experience to realize declaring war was something of the past and that surprise was germany’s biggest advantage in battle. I dont think we would have stood a chance anyway, we were outnumbered, our country is small, our army obsolete and germany had the best army at its time.

Russia lacking technology ? No… they lack the ressource to put in pratice their technology, they have tons of brilliant scientists/mathematicians. They lack organisation… russia was corrupted Before, While and After communism.

Also Oil will probably not be as important in 100 years as it is now. Not that i believe Islam will never be a major power (like it was), but i don’t think they will be because of the Oil.

@FinsterniS:

Russia lacking technology ? No… they lack the ressource to put in pratice their technology, they have tons of brilliant scientists/mathematicians. They lack organisation… russia was corrupted Before, While and After communism.

Also Oil will probably not be as important in 100 years as it is now. Not that i believe Islam will never be a major power (like it was), but i don’t think they will be because of the Oil.

weird. I’m agreeing with FinsterniS.
Call me a conspiracy theorist, however i think that the Western World’s reliance on oil-based fuel is the only thing proping up the middle east’s power consortiums, and ironically this is caused by the republican party’s:1) catering to Texas and oil concersn, 2) anti-environment-pro-industry stance, and 3) catering to Michigan and the auto-industry. Once the western world cares more about the environment, and becomes creative (see: Ballard fuel cells etc.) about oil, then the middle east’s stock is going to fall rapidly.

Also Emugod i have been to and through Anne Frank’s house. wow. It’s unbelievable. The conspiracy theories still flutter as to who gave away the presence of the family.

Actually (like I’ve said before) a shift of our gas powered electrical plants to Nuclear power would cut down our oil problems by a lot. Problem is, politics keeps that from happening.

Japan would be a problem for China, yes, but I don’t think it could resist for long. China does not have a large navy, but its vast numbers (and therefore, industrial production) would overcome Japan. By law, Japan cannot instigate a war. They have a very small army, it can’t even be called an army by law, just a “self defense force”.

Europe does have serious Oil concerns. However, Britain is 100% self sufficient.