AA50 on Steroids!

@KnowMad IIRC the next major Anniversary is next year in 2024 so maybe it will be released then.

IMO, 1942SE should be deprecated in favor of 1942 Third Edition which should be Anniversary Ed with some of the updated rules for AAA guns, etc. But that’s just my opinion; only Renegade knows what is in store for A&A.

@SS-GEN
Your welcome :)

@vodot said in [AA50 & AA42.2] Fixed Cost Techs + Tech Expansion:

This is a work in progress, but I’m putting it out here for ideas and feedback if anyone is interested in geeking out on something like this.

This is an expanded list of techs with fixed costs (no more die rolls) that would simply come into effect immediately (unless otherwise specified) for the cost shown. Some of these have a cost of 5 IPCs, with the intention of simply enabling what are essentially house rules/new units (Mechanized Infantry, Cheaper Naval units, rudimentary dogfight rules, etc.) while allowing players with no interest/need for them to ‘opt out’ and save the 5 IPCs. I’ll be using this list for my next solo game and will be making adjustments.

Note: The ‘Turkish Pact’ tech is designed for games where the Turkish Straits begin the game closed (via house rule), but also works for games where the straits start open as per OOB rules (in which case, upon the development of ‘Turkish Pact’ they would cease to be a special case of “Always Open” straits and revert to the normal OOB straits rules (closed to units unfriendly to the controller of Turkey).

Fixed_cost_Tech_v2.xls

SIR, THIS IS PURE GOLD! :)

STANDARD AAMC RULES FOR AA50 KREMLIN

AA50 Kremlin will be played at AAMC using AA50 AAMC Rules (http://aamc.net/bunker/forumsql/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=40) with modifications as noted below.

PRE-GAME BONUS PLACEMENT AND BIDDING

A) Order of Bonus Options.

Players will select four bonus options each…but if both agree then they can choose up to eleven options each. The lower ranked player gets to pick for either axis or allies and gets the first bonus option. The higher ranked player gets to pick the next option for the opposing side. Players alternate selections until finished with their agreed number of bonus options. Players bid for side. Order of action following the bid: Once the bid is finalized and one of the players is Axis and the other Allies, players have to:
1. Declare where to place or retreat troops affected by options in the order they were chosen (for example, if the Axis chose bonus option 10 takeover Archangel and then the Axis chose bonus option 3 Argentina and Mongolia joins Axis, the Allied player would retreat the Archangel units before the Axis player places the Argentinian navy).
2. Placement of unit(s) if the bid is positive, or allocation of funds to allies in the case of a negative bid.
3. Start the game.

B) Bonus Options
Bonus options(11 total) are as follows: (The same option may not be selected twice by the same player).

Infantry Placement - Place three infantry on any territory not adjacent to one containing enemy units. Infantry must be placed on its own territory, for example UK infantry cannot be placed in Novosibirsk.  All three infantry must be placed on the same territory.

Artillery/Tank Placement - Place one artillery and one tank on any territories not adjacent to one containing enemy units.  Same rules as infantry placement except the artillery and tank may be placed on different territories and be owned by different powers.  For example you may place a Japanese tank and an Italian artillery.

Neutral Territories - Take over two neutral powers whose IPC values add up to no more than four ipc’s, you take over their armies as well. (One country does not have to take control of both neutrals, for example Germany may take over Switzerland while Japan may take over Mongolia)…if a neutral has a naval unit place it in the nearest friendly sea zone.

Spain(3inf, 1 artillery), 3IPC’s
Sweden(2 inf, 1 artillery, 1 destroyer), 3IPC’s
Turkey(2 inf, 1 artillery, 1 destroyer, Dardanelles access), 3IPC’s
Saudi Arabia(1 infantry), 3IPC’s
Afghanistan(1 infantry, 1 artillery), 2IPC’s
Switzerland(1 infantry, 1 fighter), 2IPC’s
Argentina(2 infantry, 1 transport, 1 cruiser), 2IPC’s
Peru(1 infantry, 1 submarine), 1IPC
South Eire(2 infantry), 1IPC
Venezuela(1 infantry), 1IPC
Angola(1 infantry), 1IPC
Mozambique(1 infantry), 1IPC

Note: IPC values are not just for neutral selection…they are worth IPC’s in the game…add the neutral IPC total to your total IPC’s if you control it.  Neutrals not taken by a pick are not worth IPC’s if taken in a game.

Transport/Submarine Placement - You may receive two transports, two submarines, or a submarine and a transport; they must be placed adjacent to its own territory or in a sea zone containing other friendly naval units, but not in the same sea zone with enemy units. They may be placed in different sea zones.  They may be owned by seperate powers…for example you may place a Russian transport and a UK submarine.

Destroyer/Cruiser Placement - You receive one destroyer and one cruiser using the same placement rules as Option 4.

Fighter Placement - Must be placed on its own territory, for example a UK fighter may not be placed in Brazil. A fighter may be placed on a friendly carrier.

Bomber Placement - Must be placed on its own territory, for example a UK bomber may not be placed in Brazil.

Factory/AA gun Placement - This factory may only produce as many units per round as the IPC value of the territory it is placed in. The AA gun must be placed in the same territory as the factory.

Carrier OR Battleship Placement - Must be placed adjacent to its own territory or in a sea zone containing other friendly naval units but not in the same sea zone with enemy units.

Takeover of enemy held territory - Place an infantry and an artillery on said territory and retreat any enemy forces to the nearest enemy territory.(The player who wins the retreating side decides where to retreat those units after the bidding process is complete if there is more than one eligible territory to retreat to.) A territory that contains a factory may not be taken using this option.

Special “What-if” Scenarios …a scenario may not be chosen if the opposing side has affected a territory or sea zone involved in the scenario with a bonus option (Please note that as with any other bonus option, only one special scenario may be chosen by each player)

AXIS SCENARIOS
1)Operation Felix- Gibraltar captured by German forces…Place two German infantry on Gibraltar…UK naval forces in Seazone 12 are destroyed.
2)Germany launches Paratrooper Assault on Syria/Iraq- Add one German infantry to Syria/Iraq…UK forces destroyed.  Italy retains control of Italian East Africa with one infantry and Axis forces retain control of French Madagascar…place one German infantry on French Madagascar.
3)Germany gains advantage in air war over Britain- Germany contines to attack RAF installations instead of bombing civilian areas…Remove one UK fighter and UK bomber from United Kingdom.
4)Carrier force at Pearl Harbor- In Japan’s attack on Pearl Harbor the US carrier force is in port…Move the US Carrier/fighter from Seazone 44 to Seazone 53.  In addition only the carrier can defend…the fighter is caught on the carrier if Japan attacks Pearl Harbor Round 1 and may not defend.  One hit will destroy the carrier/fighter.  The fighter acts normally if it survives the attack.  If this scenerio is chosen in the 1942 version simply remove the carrier and fighter from the Hawaii Seazone(SZ 53).
5)Japan attacks on Russia go well- This scenerio assumes that superior Japanese leadership won the border war…Japan takes Buryatia S.S.R. with one infantry and one artillery…Russian units destroyed.
6)Japan offensive against China goes well- Japan makes inroads into the Chinese interior…Add one Japanese infantry to Suiyuan and Ningxia…Chinese units destroyed.

ALLIED SCENARIOS
1)No Russian Purge- Place two Russian infantry and an artillery in both Kazakh S.S.R. and Novosibirsk.
2)USSR crushes Finland in Winter War- Place one Russian infantry and one tank in Finland, German units destroyed.
3)German paratrooper assault on Crete fails…Remove one Italian cruiser from Seazone 14 and remove German artillery from Libya.  Add an additional UK destroyer to Seazone 35(Bay of Bengal).  If this scenerio is chosen in the 1942 version remove the German infantry from Libya.
4)Enigma decoded earlier- Britain does better in Battle of Atlantic than historically…Remove one German submarine from each Seazone 5 and 7 and add a UK transport to Seazone 2.
5)Early USA Mobilization- Place a submarine and a transport in Seazone 20, a tank and an artillery in Western USA, and one infantry in Brazil.
6)More US support to China…Add one infantry, one artillery, one aagun, and one fighter to Yunnan…these units are considered Chinese units and cannot leave China.

Bonus Option Clarifications:

-A territory or sea zone affected by a bonus option may not be affected in following selections by the opposing side.
Example- If the player selecting the axis bonus options chooses to place a fighter on French-Indo China then it would be illegal for the other player to takeover French-Indo China.

-A territory or sea zone affected by a bonus option may be affected by other bonus options from that same side.
Example- Both players agree to play with 4 bonus options…The player selecting the axis bonus options chooses to take over Egypt, he may place a factory(and aa gun) on Egypt for his second bonus, a bomber on Egypt for his third bonus and a submarine and transport in the Arabian Sea(Seazone 34) for his fourth bonus…

-Bonus selections once made may have an impact on all remaining bonus selections.
Example- The player selecting the axis bonus options decides to take over Argentina and Mongolia as one of his bonus options, USA may not place three infantry on Brazil since it is now adjacent to a territory containing enemy units.

C) Bidding

-The standard method of bidding will be a closed bid using the bidding link in the Bunker (one time bid). HOWEVER, If both players agree, the bid can be “auction style” instead.
Explanation of Bid for Axis “auction style”:
The lowest-ranked player will make the first bid; if the ranks are equal, the lowest-rated player will make the first bid; if the rates are equal, the player with the lowest number of games played will make the first bid; if the games played are equal, alphabetical order determines the player who makes the first bid.
When bidding, a player must declare “how much” meaning how many IPC’s he is bidding to take (or in the case of a negative bid give away) to play the axis powers.
The other player then (1) bids a lower number of IPC’s. - again, providing “how much” or (2) stops the bidding and gives his opponent the Axis powers at the last bid. Bidding goes back and forth between the players until one of the players chooses option (2).
The lowest bidder then plays the Axis. German units may be placed only on German-owned territories and sea zones; Japanese units may be placed only on Japanese-owned territories and sea zones. Italian units may be placed only on Italian-owned territories and sea zones. A sea zone is owned by a country if it is adjacent to a territory which the country owns.
NOTE: Players do not have to declare what they are buying nor where the bid units will be placed during the bidding process.  In the case of a negative bid the allied player will receive additional IPC’s to disperse to the allied IPC’s on hand in any desired distribution prior to the start of the game.

D) Rules Clarifications

(1) No Tech until round 4 and then…
Only 2 tech tokens per side (Axis or Allied) per round may be purchased; until one side gets a tech, then additional tech tokens are allowed for both sides.  One additional tech token is allowed for each technology gained.

Tech Example- Japan, Italy, and Germany combined may purchase 2 tech tokens per round in total; UK, USA, and USSR combined may also purchase 2 tech tokens per round combined.  As techs are gained additional tech dice may be purchased.  Example: Italy gains paratroopers then both sides may purchase up to 3 tech tokens per round combined on the following game turn (GER in 1941 version, and Russia in 1942 Version).  On the next turn if the United Kingdom was to obtain Jet Power then both sides may purchase up to 4 tech tokens per round and so on…

(2) No unit chosen with a bonus option can be involved in an attack on a territory with an original factory on Round 1…to discourage gambit bonus options and bids.

(3) Straight Rules- No naval movement allowed through these areas unless one side owns both sides of the Straight at the beginning of their turn.  These include the Straight of Gibraltar, Baltic Straight, and the Dardanelles Straight.

(4) Victory City move…Move the victory city in Ottawa to Capetown, South Africa.

(5) Special China Rules for AA50 Kremlin Games

-China makes a restricted first move in Kremlin AA50 games before any other power moves…this is only a non-combat movement phase and China may not conduct combat or place additional units for territory controlled at the end of the turn.  The game proceeds as normal after this non-combat movement.
-Bonus Options 1, 2, 6, and 7 may be chosen for China…such units may not leave Chinese controlled territory.  Bonus Option 10 may be chosen by China but can only be used against axis-controlled territories that China is eligible to attack.  The only neutral selectable by China in Bonus Option 3 is Afghanistan.
-In addition to all the territories that Chinese units are eligible to enter and attack in the regular version of the game…In AA50 Kremlin China may enter or attack Burma(reverts to UK control if taken by China) and French Indo-China.
-Chinese planes may attack axis ships adjacent to Chinese controlled territories.
-If the Burma Road(India, Burma, Yunnan) is under allied control at the beginning of Chinas turn then China may upgrade one infantry unit to an artillery unit(in Yunnan only).
-If the Burma Road(India, Burma, Yunnan) is under allied control at the end of Chinas turn then China may place an extra infantry unit.
-There are no stacking limits on Chinese units…an eligible territory may contain any number of Chinese units.
-China receives infantry for its placement phase at the rate of one infantry for every two territories controlled at the end of its combat phase.

source: http://www.aamc.net/bunker/forumsql/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2492

@variable:

It doesn’t make things any more difficult for the allies there. It just becomes a balanced trade off. If the allies decide to put resources into it, there is a payoff. If the axis decides to challenge it, the allies end up with an expensive meat grinder that may happen anyway.

Exactly.

I like it.

@bugoo:

As far as tech goes I would propose a point system.  Assign a point value to each tech.  Purchase researchers as normal.  Roll as normal for research, but add up the total rolls and apply them toward the selected tech.  You could assign different researches to different techs, but cannot change the tech they work on once purchased.  Once point value is reached, tech is gained said researchers are lost.  For example.

As US I want heavy bombers eventually, they are worth 30 research, so on turn 1 I purchase one heavy bomber researcher.  I roll and get a 3.  Now I need 27 more research to get heavy bombers.  On turn 2 I decide I want super subs, and since that tech isn’t as powerful I only need 15 research to get them.  I purchase 2 researchers, both for the subs as I want to sink japan’s navy now.  I roll a 2 for my heavy bomber researcher, leaving 25 left, and then roll a 4 and a 5 for my subs, leaving 6 left and with any luck on turn 3 i’ll get my super subs.

This will allow you to slowly work at a tech, rush for it, and choose to go for the good but expensive techs, or take an easier, faster, tech, or all of the above.  Now all nations may buy a heavy bomber researcher turn 1, but hey there is nothing wrong with that!

Hello.  I am digging up this as the tech lovers/haters discussions have started to heat up.

I re-read your thoughts and am wondering if you ever did anything more with this idea of a tech pointing system.  Did you ever come up with point targets for each tech?

The neat thing about this is that it can be easily tweaked with out re-writing the whole process.

Or you could go one step further and adjust the targets by country too.  For example, make super subs very low (read affordable) for Russian super subs or something like that, or even harder for the wealthy countries (like extra points for USA for Long Range)

You’re right, I don’t think Russia and Germany can Fall to any sort of allied attack. Thats why the allied victory conditions are for it to only stop Axis from cliaiming Africa Asia before USA creates a Atom Bomb (by turn X) and forces a treaty/surrender.

As it was, the only ground Axis had gained by turn 4 was Persia, Trans Jordan and 1 territory in China It had lost Libiya. If you had asked my opponet who was Axis, he would say my bid was already high.

@dpdlc:

I never understood, how researching a technology would instantly upgrade your units for 0 cost. While doctrines is a change in tactical thinking, using units differently. You don’t actually have to build anything or upgrade anything, but the techniques in battle change and represent a learning experience.

In real life:

Germany focus on armored manuver warfare, to encircle their enemies.
France focused on static defenses.

US focused heavily on heavy bombers and daylight raids.
While Brittain focused on night bombers.

Russia focused on heavy preliminary artillery bombardment, for battles.
while the US had artillery available quickly to lower lever units. (“RADIO”)

Japan developed the expertise and techniques for night battles.

I think these things add a  little bit to flavor in the game.

Hi dpdlc,

What you’re describing sounds like the National Advantages available in A&A Revised.  These were nation specific advantages that reflected certain tactics, special units, or strategies used by the different A&A nations.

It’s a shame they took these out of AA50 because you are absolutely correct, when balanced appropriately, they can add tremendous flavor to a game (check out AAR: Enhanced which uses a much more balanced set of national advantages compared to AAR OOTB)