Best place to bomb Japan from?

[Heinz Guderian]

Doing a KJF strategy playing as the US, what have you found to be the best place to SBR Tokyo from?

USSR territories?
Iwo Jima?
Mainland Asia?
Somewhere else?

[drummerinheat]

Iwo, if u can take it, is inconvenient for Japan to take back.  Hard to nab and keep mainland territories.  I would be more focused on the Japanese fleet than SBRs on Tokyo, but if the opportunity presents itself, doesn’t hurt to try.

[teslas]

I never see the need to bomb Japan. I would usually rather have two more submarines to secure SZ 6, to blow up the IJN, or to convoy than I would another strat bomber in the pacific.

You can hurt Japan’s economy by being aggressive in other ways, and you usually have a very real threat of a Japanese counterattack devastating the allies while you do it that is always looming over you. A strat bomber can’t defend your fleet. Another fighter, 1.5 destroyers, or a couple subs can, and they can also take part in a naval attack just like the bomber could.

If you’re already at the point of having turned the tide in the pacific, it’s not worth your time trying to bomb an already-crippled Japan or to try and invade a turtled-up Japan. Just wrap them up enough so that ANZAC/China can keep them busy, then hurry your ass up in the Atlantic.

That’s not to say strat bombers aren’t useful in the pacific. They surely are, and one or two can clear destroyer blocks, or threaten sea zones that you couldn’t normally threaten (as to keep undefended transports from moving around), or help with some island hopping by not putting your navy in harm’s way to support a lone transport + infantry drop. They can also be built in western US for a one-last-build before a big fight since they can fly quite far to make it to the next round’s combat. But to plan on bombing Tokyo? Meh.

And to think from where is best? That all depends where your bombers night need to go next round. Mainland asia might be able to get them to Moscow to be defense fodder there (Jehol, maybe others?). The far eastern USSR territories might be your only option for a turn, and therefore would be best by definition. Iwo Jima is nice in that it’s easy to defend and is close, and reaches much of the Pacific. But it all just depends on that particular game since this kind of concern is, at best, an A3, but very probably an A4-A6 situation, and too much can change by then to give an answer.

Finally, if you do begin to win the Pacific, your bombers, if any are still in the pacific, are some of the first units that leave the theater for the Atlantic side, because they can get there and be effective faster than anything else that you have.

If I’m wrong on this one, and have been overlooking something that is vital to the pacific war effort by not bombing Tokyo, please enlighten me.

[Nippon-koku]

I’m with Teslas on this one.  As far as hurting Japan economically goes, US is better off buying two subs in place of that bomber and and using them to convoy.  Plus, they’re handy to use as fodder for when you wanna take out Japanese blockers, and many subs forces Japan to spend more than they’d like on DD.

[taamvan]

Agree with above.  Last night’s Game 92 reminded me that even a single turn of American buying in Europe or buying anything but major navy in the Pacific makes Japan quite tough to beat.  I even traded major fleets with Japan off Wake and he still had plenty of money to hold me off with every turn.  The only way to put real pressure on him is to explode his home water fleet, block a counterattack with screens and take korea with your invasion transports.  If he has to blow his kamikazes trying to stop this, even better.  Japan and America are very evenly matched on U4 and U5, where only a risky diced based battle can win it for the US, even for a well placed and purchased America.  Instead of even considering the SBR you would do better to position and build your fleet such that it tears Japan in half across the entire Pacific, because if he has turtled up a huge fleet off Japan you are not that likely to have a better one by U5.

[Nippon-koku]

@taamvan:

Agree with above.   Last night’s Game 92 reminded me that even a single turn of American buying in Europe or buying anything but major navy in the Pacific makes Japan quite tough to beat.  I even traded major fleets with Japan off Wake and he still had plenty of money to hold me off with every turn.  The only way to put real pressure on him is to explode his home water fleet, block a counterattack with screens and take korea with your invasion transports.  If he has to blow his kamikazes trying to stop this, even better.   Japan and America are very evenly matched on U4 and U5, where only a risky diced based battle can win it for the US, even for a well placed and purchased America.   Instead of even considering the SBR you would do better to position and build your fleet such that it tears Japan in half across the entire Pacific, because if he has turtled up a huge fleet off Japan you are not that likely to have a better one by U5.

Are you suggesting that America spend close to 100% in the Pacific every turn?  Can’t say I agree with that at all

[The Hessian]

Any player of Germany or Italy would be VERY pleased about this decision.  :-D

[SubmersedElk]

The question is, how can the Allies pose a credible threat to the Japanese navy without 100% US Pac buys?

As-is, it seems the choice given to the Allies is “Let Germany go hog wild” vs. “Let Japan go hog wild”. There’s no in between or shades of grey, as anything less than a full commitment just leaves them undermanned in both theaters rather than just one.

[teslas]

Germany cannot go “hog wild” with a competent UK/Soviet player without some truly decent dice luck. Germany can push up to Moscow, but they often times can’t take Moscow immediately. That, and they can’t really spend their resources in any way but to facilitate as much power as is possible against Russia, or risk losing a turn (or worse, two), toward the eventual goal in the east.

Right about the time the European Axis are crashing the gates or ducking south for that sweet, sweet Caucasus/Volgo/Middle East money, America should be turning around or have already turned around form the Pacific.

On the other hand, Japan fucking can go hog wild without American intervention: J1 DoW specifically. I favor 100% Pac buys as the US (apart from maybe the first 52 or a sub or two a turn or whatever else, depending on a ton of situations that can’t be covered here) because the sooner you can start crumpling up Japan, the sooner you can go try to play hero in Europe.

It might be worth mentioning that Hawaii and Gibraltar are “only” two turns away from one another. It is not impossible to change your mind. It’s usually not the best idea, mind you, but it is an option, and it is occasionally useful.