Ok, so if I corrected all the mistakes I made in my first PBF game with you, we should see the second game created HERE!
GL&HF
:)
The ADS vs. LL debate
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So you would ahve played it differently… You’d have brought 2 TRN along to make it 5 units instead of 3 attacking that fleet.
2 TRN that would not be disgourging troops to Asia that round… one of which MAYBE 2 of which would be sunk and never transport anything again…
2 FIGs that end up Carrier based and not used for combat in Asia either that turn OR the next…So it is STILL a diversion, one you yourself would have gone after… a basically worthless fleet in terms of threat to the Axis would have drawn off more than half of your AF for 2 turns, drawn off half of your transport capacity for a turn, and resulted in the loss of 25% to 50% of your current transport capacity.
You had in right in your first post…
That BB, TRN and 2 INF was a negligable threat to Japan, and should have been ignored. The 1-4 IPC’s that would have shifted would have little to no bearing on the game… certainly far less than the loss of 3 aircraft…
and probably less than the loss of even a single TRN, and the units that were not trannied to Asia the round the trannies were serving as cannon fodder, and 2 of your FIGs ending up AC based and out of range for attacks in Asia the next round (based on your version of that battle AS) -
Well first off, 3 FIGs could not have reached.
Second… I play a bit different thatn a lot of folks (as you keep pointing out). My PACFLT is considered dead at start. So ANY gain they make is worth while. And killing a fair amount of enemy before they die is a GOOD thing.
As for the BOM and 2 TRN comparison…
Having Germany risk that bomber (which admitedly did not pay off THIS game) for just 2 TRN early… More than half the time the bomber would die on that attack… reducing Germany’s AF a nice chunk AND reducing the requirements for screening of TRN’s since Germany would be down to just FIGs with low range.For each move, there is a counter.
For each strat there is a counter.And every now and then… screwed up ideas WORK… especially when folks are used to playing a certain way agaisnt certain strats.
Darth (and probably you too AS) are too skilled for that to be immediately fatal.
But unpredictability can in itself be an asset in this game (who would have thought that Russia would funnel a number of divisions to Africa when be crunched east and west?)
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@AgentSmith:
Well first off, 3 FIGs could not have reached.
That’s his mistake not mine.
3 ftrs could have reached but only 2 could land on AC, (to bring a 3rd it would have to land on an island) to sol is. But you should note he hit with both his trn and BB, so even if you brought in a million planes you still would have lost one.
A Wizard never makes mistakes, he always makes his moves precisely as he means to.
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The Rus ftr did occur to me, but I really liked the way G1 went and ended up going with a middle of the road Pearl which kinda bit me in the butt as well. Ultimately, I felt I didn’t have to do that this game (read fear of dicey - :-D )
But with the 4 hits at Pearl, it probably would have been better to hit Yak.
:-)Or lighten up my Chi attack. But I’ve been dicey’d in Chi before many times, so ultimately I chose a bit of a safer J1.
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Idd, if you would have gone after that fig, you would have had like 4 inf and 2 figs to attack there… That is kind of a gamble…
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Ok, I’ve got a lot of things to say, but not much time at the moment (will come back with those ?'s and points later).
However, I’ve got a simple concern that one of you can clear up.
Please explain how combat would be resolved involving a fighter attacking a sub using LL. Now, my rules are a bit rusty, and I’m going from 2nd edition (don’t have revised), but I believe the fighter gets one shot before the sub is allowed to submerge. If that’s not the case and the combat is invalid, then obviously just say so. :-D If it is valid then my suspicion can be rooted out by a simple explanation. Also, I didn’t read all of the specific rules for LL at the bottom - mostly skimmed through - so there may already be something that addresses this.
Thanks, and hope to pick this back up ASAP.
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It is treated the same way as it is treated with ADS.
Yep, the ftr gets one shot, then the sub can retreat. A ftr still needs a 3 or lower for the hit.
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OK… so AS is sitting there Armchair Quarterbacking this game… making negative comments on Darth;s play… and basically ignoring anything I do or attempt, except to deride it.
At least AS has FINALLY taken on a game in the forums for other sto make snide comments and armchair quarterback :-P
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switch, AS has played several games on these forums.
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Ah, but most of them were lost to the great erase a while back…
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Oh no doubt I have made some mistakes in this game… heck of a lot of them actually.
And no, it takes nothing away from me, win or lose, in how you characterize DM’s play.
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One should play by this motto:
What would Brian Boitano Do?
:-D
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Yeah, I’ve definitely been interested in seeing that game play out. But obviously I don’t know what’s taking him so long … I don’t think he’s scared though, since he wasn’t afraid to lose 4 or so games in a row as he played switch, me, and DM. Losing one more wouldn’t be that big a deal.
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It’s possible he didn’t realize you completed your move, since you just editted your first post.
I’ll go up the thread.
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Was it a half completed map? :-)
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It is treated the same way as it is treated with ADS.
Yep, the ftr gets one shot, then the sub can retreat. A ftr still needs a 3 or lower for the hit.
Thanks, DM.
So it’s only with multiple units that LL actually comes into play? I hoped so. I’ll come back to this debate soon, just not enough time at the moment (and I see everyone is occupied with games anyway…).
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Yes. Any 1 on 1 battle is exactly the same in LL or ADS.
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For those who think that lowluck is totally predictable, consider this. In my game against DM I sent a ger bb + trn vs a uk bb. I was wiped out and the uk bb was still floating. Against Avin with the same battle, both my ships survived and the uk bb became a coral reef!! That’s quite a swing. What lowluck does is prevent an extreme such as me sending in 4 arm vs 2 inf and all my arm miss and the 2 inf drill me. In lowluck, I know that I’m going to nail the 2 inf bastards, which is how it should be. Now if they would just change that nutty sbr rule in lowluck, I’d be a big fan!!!
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I’m new to LL… what is this SBR problem you have?
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In LL, bombers can’t be shot down during SBR’s. So to simulate the loss of bombers to AA-fire, the attacker also loses IPC when he does a SBR.
Example, if Germany does an SBR on Russia, the Russian player will lose either 2, 3, or 4 IPC, BUT the German player will also lose either 2 or 3 IPC (which is taken out of the cash they earn at the end of their turn).
There are situations where either side can really exploit this, but for the most part I don’t think it really comes into play until one side already gains an advantage.
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