What if R1 goes VERY BAD!?!

@theROCmonster:

G1 Egypt without the fighter is 2 infantry arty tank fighter bomber vs inf tank fighter… not that big of a risk at all.

When I am Germany it is.  :-P :wink:

When I would play Revised more often, I had a penchant for having that battle go horribly wrong. We usualyl had 7 bids for Germany which meant inf/art in Libya

The best example.
With 3 inf, 1 art, 2 tanks, 1 ftr, 1 bmb, I rolled 12 out of 13 6’s the first 2 rounds. He got 4 hits the first two rounds. I wish I still had the screenshots.

I eventually I had ftr/bmb left and I think all he had was ftr, but I still retreated. Sometimes you just gotta know when the dice hate you and it is futile to object.

@Mallery29:

E.Europe as the territory, not as a whole

Let me rephrase: Allies control E. Europe, they control the entire Eastern front and deny its income to Germany and secure it to themselves. Let Japan have Africa (and divert units away from Russia).

@Varn:

Based on your description, I have analyzed your situation carefully. I have identified your three options. You may be able to search this forum for articles that inform you which of these three is best for you given the exact situation:

1.) German prison/labor camp.
2.) Japanese prison/labor camp.
3.) Apologize heavily to the Germans. Agree to do more chores around the house. They may agree to let the Russians join the Axis, but only this once and only as a house rule.

Don’t take option number 1, I heard they got quite a bad rep around the historical period we’re talking about.

1.  You can transport units from S Eur to Libya and consolidate so you have 6 German ground in Libya at end of G1.  This allows Germany to make a serious play for Africa regardless of the fate of the Mediterranean battleship.

2.  If Russia wants to spend precious precious air on a shot against my German battleship, they’re welcome to it.

3.  If Russia screws around with anything but inf/art/tank, it opens the door for early German control of Karelia, particularly if Germany abandons Africa.  (They don’t HAVE to abandon Africa, but if they DO, it’s much harder to stop Germany).  One or two units can make a big difference in the balance of power.

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Re:  German control of Africa:  German control of Africa and preservation of the German Mediterranean fleet can be a big plus.   Germany has more income.  Japan doesn’t need to devote as much power to Africa, leaving it to put more pressure on Russia - and with a KGF in play, Japan’s will be the main attack.

That isn’t to say the Germans HAVE to be in Africa.  But if the Germans can get into Africa without giving up too much position in Europe, it’s something to think about.

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To answer the OP - if Russia buys any non-ground units on R1, I’m immediately thinking about ways to make major major nasty attacks.  Like “Break West Russia with Germany or secure Ukraine, build 8 G1 tanks, build 2 ICs with Japan, and tank tank tank east and west” - that sort of thinking.  It might not be possible to smash Russia up real fast, but things can be REAL nasty real quick if Russia leaves 6 infantry on Buryatia, or bled strength off towards Africa/India, or did anything else not along the lines of a UKR/WR open.

I have much to learn!  Thank you all very much for your input!

Just to clarify….the OP is referring to the AE gambit in low luck.  So he’s not really risking much by taking one less fig to UKR…he will still take it 100% but just with higher than av. losses.

It’s difficult to judge the efficacy of the gambit because whether it works or not depends on dice and the German player’s reaction.  If Germany ends up skipping SZ2…then it worked.  Or if Germany fails to actually take Egy, it worked.  The main risk is if Germany goes to both 2 and Egy and succeeds…  On the other hand, sometimes Germany will go to both 2 and Egy and get diced up…even 2 is not a sure thing in low luck because of the Russian sub.

Honestly Granada I would have to show you in a game. Not to sound cocky but I am very good and don’t make mistakes. For this strategy to work you have know when you are able to move your infantry stacks out of Germany/southern Germany/Eastern Europe/ and sometime karelia if you are here. You are correct in that germany won’t have much attack power. I almost always build 10 inf 2 tanks R1. Gives Germany some options on R2. Even possibly sending a tank to africa if your fleet was not destroyed. The thing is Germany doesn’t need attack power so much as Stacking power. 6 tanks =30 while as 10 infantry=30 is a huge difference. The more units you can stack in a Certain area the better. I am not a big fan of trying to take an hold western Europe. I Usually give this up very early on in the game and send almost everything at Russia. Germany’s tanks are vital in holding back both russia and US and UK. Try keeping Germany tankss in Eastern Europe. This both protects against a combined stack in western europe from the allies, and also is realy scary to russia and can hit many fronts on your eastern theatre.

@Fleetwood:

As a side note, not attacking z2 doesn’t mean the Allies get a totally free pass in the Atlantic. Say Germany commits a sub and 2-3 fighters to the Med cruiser. 2/3 of the time the sub lives. If Germany builds a bomber G1 and the med sub lives and the Baltic subs escape, they will still be able to kill a round one Allied move to z8 2/3 of the time. That’s 3 subs, 4 fighters, 2 bombers vs 2 destroyers, 1 sub, 1 carrier, 2 fighters, 1 cruiser, and 4 transports using this calculator. http://www.dskelly.com/misc/aa/aasim.html

Are you saying that Germany should buy a cruiser and a destroyer for the Med on G1, and not use the Z8 sub to splash the Canadian transport, but retreat it into the Med (Z13 is as far as it can reach)? This takes away half of Germany’s income, which means it can only commit 20 IPCs to the land battle with Russia, and allows UK to retain both of its Atlantic transports. I don’t know if that is a good move…