Germany-US vs UK-Japan-USSR

Maybe a Germany, UK, Japan vs USSR and US

However Germany turns everytHing to the east and Japan starts to TDTM and takes alaska. USSR Eventually gets killed and US is stuck needing to beat Uk and Japanese navy

So USSR,Japan v UK, Germany vs US could be intersting UK has to deal with Japan in the Pacific and US/Germany in Europe. The SU need to beat germany without UK and US help and maybe some Japanese fighters are needed in Cau and Rus to help defend. Japan plays as normal Taking the Pacific and Africa with no need to TDTM and so could also land in Alaska.

That would be very interesting

i think the most balanced way to change up the teams would be GER + UK vs RUS + JAP + US.  the german/british side i think would be stronger than the normal Axis, but not so much.  UK vs. JAP in the pacific and south asia would play out pretty much the same, but the UK BB would give the ‘new axis’ a good position in the atlantic.  UK would be able to quickly help germany pressure russia, but they would hang on to most of their income and japan can be of considerable help in propping up moscow.  US would have to focus on taking the atlantic, they’d have to go either africa or europe.

ANYWAY, it would be the same starting economies, except UK is a stronger power, due to not having to fight for africa initially and stronger in the atlantic.

@ragnarok628:

i think the most balanced way to change up the teams would be GER + UK vs RUS + JAP + US.   the german/british side i think would be stronger than the normal Axis, but not so much.  UK vs. JAP in the pacific and south asia would play out pretty much the same, but the UK BB would give the ‘new axis’ a good position in the atlantic.  UK would be able to quickly help germany pressure russia, but they would hang on to most of their income and japan can be of considerable help in propping up moscow.  US would have to focus on taking the atlantic, they’d have to go either africa or europe.

ANYWAY, it would be the same starting economies, except UK is a stronger power, due to not having to fight for africa initially and stronger in the atlantic.

UK would need Germany’s help in stopping the US from constantly unloading on them.

@ragnarok628:

i think the most balanced way to change up the teams would be GER + UK vs RUS + JAP + US.   the german/british side i think would be stronger than the normal Axis, but not so much.  UK vs. JAP in the pacific and south asia would play out pretty much the same, but the UK BB would give the ‘new axis’ a good position in the atlantic.  UK would be able to quickly help germany pressure russia, but they would hang on to most of their income and japan can be of considerable help in propping up moscow.  US would have to focus on taking the atlantic, they’d have to go either africa or europe.

ANYWAY, it would be the same starting economies, except UK is a stronger power, due to not having to fight for africa initially and stronger in the atlantic.

I actually like this a lot. I’ll have to try this one. You may have to mix up turn orders though. 1-2 punch from UK and Germany hitting Russia on subsequent turns could be too much. I would disagree on UK being stronger though. Japan has lots of territories to take quickly in most games, UK would have almost nothing to grab in your scenario, plus they will lose canada, india australia quick.

I did forget about losing canada.  but then, they can consolidate in E Canada, add 2 TRN of units + 2 fighters turn 1.  this would be a decent defense against what US can throw at that territory R1.

i don’t think the US would be able to constantly unload on UK because of the initial naval advantage.  UK and GER can consolidate fleets right on the US eastern seaboard and with only modest reinforcements could prevent the US from taking control for several rounds at least.

i think mr.biggg is right about UK in that they’ll have to worry about keeping up their income, though.  i guess the only expansion is russia.  i don’t think they stand a chance at making any progress further east, they’ll definitely lose their islands and india quickly.  japan doesn’t have as many expansion territories as in a normal game because of russia being an ally, so mostly they’ll just take islands and take the route through india to africa.  Germany will probably need to protect that route, and UK can make up for it by helping against russia.

I’m interested to try this.  i don’t think i’d switch turn order, though, because i think any switches will just make things worse for UK or Russia.

@ragnarok628:

i think the most balanced way to change up the teams would be GER + UK vs RUS + JAP + US.   the german/british side i think would be stronger than the normal Axis, but not so much.  UK vs. JAP in the pacific and south asia would play out pretty much the same, but the UK BB would give the ‘new axis’ a good position in the atlantic.  UK would be able to quickly help germany pressure russia, but they would hang on to most of their income and japan can be of considerable help in propping up moscow.  US would have to focus on taking the atlantic, they’d have to go either africa or europe.

ANYWAY, it would be the same starting economies, except UK is a stronger power, due to not having to fight for africa initially and stronger in the atlantic.

Sounds kinda interesting, but US+Rus+Jap will have a huge advantage over Ger+UK. Germany and UK would need a quick victory against Russia to win, and I think that they will be stopped by fighters from US and Japan. I’m sure that Ger+UK would need a bid, but if you think Ger+UK is strong enough, I’d be happy to try a game against you as US+Russia+Japan, You play Germany+UK. I can do the changes in the TripleA xml file.

@ragnarok628:

I did forget about losing canada.  but then, they can consolidate in E Canada, add 2 TRN of units + 2 fighters turn 1.  this would be a decent defense against what US can throw at that territory R1.

i don’t think the US would be able to constantly unload on UK because of the initial naval advantage.  UK and GER can consolidate fleets right on the US eastern seaboard and with only modest reinforcements could prevent the US from taking control for several rounds at least.

i think mr.biggg is right about UK in that they’ll have to worry about keeping up their income, though.  i guess the only expansion is russia.  i don’t think they stand a chance at making any progress further east, they’ll definitely lose their islands and india quickly.  japan doesn’t have as many expansion territories as in a normal game because of russia being an ally, so mostly they’ll just take islands and take the route through india to africa.  Germany will probably need to protect that route, and UK can make up for it by helping against russia.

I’m interested to try this.  i don’t think i’d switch turn order, though, because i think any switches will just make things worse for UK or Russia.

PM me if (any of) you are interested in trying this scenario, the Ger+UK scenario, or a Ger+US scenario, but then I’d take US+Ger b/c I think they would have the advantage, but I have not tried any other scenarios except in Classic, where US+Ger worked almost as good as Ger+Japan. Any games (against me) will be preferably low luck, but I can accept regular dice if the opponent demands it to try this optional scenario or the Ger+US scenario.

I tried changing the alliances in TripleA, tested it against the AI, it seems fine. If anyone wants to try this, send a pm to me.

I think the US-Germany vs UK-USSR-Japan game set up could be balanced with a few minor modifications:

1. Change play order to UK, US, USSR, Germany, Japan
       -Royal Navy gets a chance to get its act together and avoid being gutted on G1
       -Africa is preserved, at least for a while
       -US Carriers allowed to escape Japanese (who won’t have the Brits to worry about)
   2)Add Chicago and subtract Manila as Victory Cities,
       -Preserves the six per side start.
   3)Alter the map slightly to make North America a little more detailed.  Too convoluted to explain in text
       -I advocate this even for Spring 1942 in general
       -I’ve sketched a proposal but can’t figure out how to add the image  :? I drive a folk-lift for a living, this sort of thing isn’t my strong-suite. The file is on my desktop.  If you want to see it tell me how to show it to you.

So my roomate and I have been playing Germany-Us vs UK Japan USSR with the turn order UK,US,USSR,G,J.

It is actually extraordinarily balanced. We’ve played over 12 turns now, probably about 10 hours, and it looks like there is no end in sight. UK got shut down but it takes fairly constant US investment to keep them down while fending off the Japanese. Germany and Russia have been going back and forth forever now. Africa was conquered by Germany and US, but is now back in UK’s hands thanks to Japan. The game may finally end if Germany can take down Moscow, but Japan has built an IC in Sinkaing to flood in defensive troops, otherwise it could be at least 5 or 6 more turns and go either way.

Started a game with Mr.Biggg’s pairing and turn order.
It’s shocking how powerful the UK is when they go first: Sank US carrier in Hawaii, German battleship in Med, and German destroyer in Baltic; captured Algeria; reenforced Egypt (total: 4I, T, B); finished UK1 with: battleship, cruiser, and  two transports off Algeria; fully-loaded carrier with cruiser and transport off Egypt; newly purchased carrier (loaded), and two destroyers in the Channel; and a loaded transport in the southern Indian Ocean.
I thought the Brits would land themselves a participation trophy….  :-o

@Nomarclegs:

Started a game with Mr.Biggg’s pairing and turn order.
It’s shocking how powerful the UK is when they go first: Sank US carrier in Hawaii, German battleship in Med, and German destroyer in Baltic; captured Algeria; reenforced Egypt (total: 4I, T, B); finished UK1 with: battleship, cruiser, and  two transports off Algeria; fully-loaded carrier with cruiser and transport off Egypt; newly purchased carrier (loaded), and two destroyers in the Channel; and a loaded transport in the southern Indian Ocean.
I thought the Brits would land themselves a participation trophy….  :-o

I’d be interested to hear what happens in the Atlantic as you and Mr.Biggg progress in your game. It seems like Germany should be focusing all of it’s attention along with the US to capture London; I’m not too sure if you can maintain a large enough fleet to prevent waves of transports (as both enemy capitals need only a pair of fleets each to have a constant stream of impending transports).

UK-USSR-Japan may be unstoppable…
US: Evaquated Hawaii; sank Kwantung transport; overran Canada; and bought two each carriers and subs (all to east coast).
USSR: Captured West Russia and Sinkiang; failed to take Belorussia; fortified Caucasus.
Germany: retook WR; took Karelia (in force); retook Algeria (saving Brazil).
Japan: Conquered China and Hawaii; consolidated Pac fleet off Hawaii; moved East Indies fleet to Carolines; sent two fighters and bomber to Caucasus IC in FIC.

All signs point to epic US/UK naval battle(s) in the Atlantic. Japan onws the Pacific; Britain owns the Med; Russian and Japanese forces pooring in to prop up Moscow.  NOT what I saw coming.

We’ve literally put about 18 hours into this game, well over 20 full turns. It looks like it will finally end with Germany taking Moscow in a turn or two.

Basic flow went like this:

First 5 rounds:

UK is a super power, the control Africa, have a fleet in the Med and in the Atlantic. Transport guys into Germany.
US built navy and bombers to invade UK. They never really get the chance though, UK loaded up about 20 inf over the first 5 turns and any landings would be futile.
Germany took out much of UK navy focused on ground game vs USSR+some UK+Japan coming in. Major battle of attrition they nearly lost.
Japan invaded Alaska and established a an Industrial complex. They constantly flooded troops into Alaska.
Russia did what Russia does, build infantry and trudge.

Next 10 rounds:
UK navy eventually gets completely destroyed by US and German air forces. They are crippled and poor for the rest of the game.
US Spends a lot of time and money fighting Japanese. Sends Transports into Archangel in Lieu of attacking UK. Loses Naval fleet to UK planes and switches to mass bombers for the Atlantic.
Germany gets pushed back pretty far into Germany by combined allied forces. With the help of US in Archangel, pushes forward though, and eventually takes Caucasus. Builds basically nothing but tanks, infantry and artillery.
Japan retakes Africa for UK, and sends ships int Mediterranean. Eventually builds some Industrial complexes in Asia to help push Germany.
Russia did what Russia does, build infantry and trudge.

Final rounds
US responds to Japan’s Asia activities by building a new Pacific fleet, eventually takes control of Pacific.
With Japaneses help, Russia vs. Caucasus is a massive stalemate, skirmishes for nearby territories ensue.
UK Can’t do much, at any point, 7 bombers are within range of anything they build. They build fighters to send to Russia.

In a few rounds it looks like Germany will have enough to take Russia.

Very fun read, enjoyable thought experiment.