Activation of Neutrals

@Caesar-Seriona said in Dutch Neutrality Question:

Because the creators thought it was enough to put their colonies in but not count it as an independent faction hence why you can’t liberate their homeland because it’s marked as German Grey and how it lacks units, income, and turn. So they make it under this stupid exile in govern status.

Sorry, I don’t get that in the context of an argumentation for your previous statement:

@Caesar-Seriona said in Dutch Neutrality Question:

The game actually treats Japan already at war with the Dutch on turn 0.

As clearly stated by the rules Japan starts the game being at war with China only.
There is no state of war between Japan and the Netherlands.

In order to attack Dutch colonies Japan needs to establish a state of war with UK/ANZAC instead.

Rulebook Pacific 1940.2, page 37:

Japan may attack Dutch territories only if a state of war exists between it and the United Kingdom and ANZAC.

Thanks for the replies everyone.

As it happens, there was some confusion about when the planes actually landed, so it turns out both my opponent and I were correct in a sense.

The UK planes actually landed on Greece during Italy’s turn after an adjacent UK carrier was damaged, so the move was legal after all.

My bad for incorrectly believing the planes landed on Greece during the UK turn, and neither of us realized what the other was talking about.  :-D

Good to see our fellow AAAers always ready to help out with good answers, though, so thanks again all.  :-)

@P@nther:

When it comes to the British turn, Yugoslavia is an Ally, because of the German attack before, so the territory of Yugoslavia is friendly to the British.

So in NCM the British fighters may land there.

Thank you! Before this thread, this effect had never really occurred to me, and I think I may have let a British plane or two sink into the Adriatic when it could have landed in Yugoslavia. Not that it would really have survived there anyway, but it’s always good to make life a bit harder for Italy when taking it.

(Unlike what the others have said, I’m not that much of a friendly kind of guy, but I did genuinely mean the line about welcoming you to the board.)

@SJS063:

Why not build a naval base in Greenland  then? get some men into uk fast in case of sealion, especially if a J1 happens?

I assume you mean if a J1 DOW happens, but in that case the US isn’t restricted to staying at East US, and I’d argue that stationing at East Canada makes a ton more sense than Greenland.

@Gargantua:

So there is a DEFINITE seperation between invading a Friendly Neutral, and a friendly/allied territory.

That is what we’re currently trying to determine.

@kcdzim:

A) if the US controls finland (or has fighters there), it’s no longer neutral.  It MUST be at war to be in Finland, no other way around it.
B) if any axis power declares war on Russia on the Europe side of the map, Russia is no longer neutral (it’s at war with someone, so it’s a friendly power to the Allies).
C) Declaring War occurs at the beginning of the move phase, and scrambling occurs at the end (at which point Russia is at war with at least one Axis power).

So in your example, as Russia is not neutral, and the US is not neutral, US planes in Finland can scramble to the seazone against an attack on Russia.

Correct, except that TheDefinitiveS said “UK”, not “US”, but that is a minor point.  Either way, the scrambling power is at war.

@kcdzim:

Neutral non player powers are different, in that they never automatically flip to a side, they just change to “friendly neutrals”.

Not exactly true.  When attacked, they join the opposite side from the attacker.

@kcdzim:

And even “friendly neutrals” require a non combat move into them to take control, even after they’re forces have been activated by a failed enemy attack.

After being attacked, they are no longer neutral, but friendly to the opposite side from their attacker.  However, the territory and forces are uncontrolled, as you say.  The question at hand is the timing of this status change.

@kcdzim:

And a friendly neutral is not the same as a player power not yet at war - they have completely different diplomatic rules.  For example, if Russia is not at war on the Europe map, Britain CANNOT noncombat move through their spaces.  It is NOT the same as a friendly neutral, for lack of a better term it’s a Neutral Power, completely different than a Friendly Neutral or a Strict Neutral.

Correct.

@tytyboogie:

thanx Mclovin…i was just thinking the same thing that the 2nd edition game i have just chilling in the closet would be a great choice to paint some neutral armies with…blue for allies?what shade of blue if france is already blue? red sounds great for axis actually…i noticed grey being used for strict neutrals as well.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          mclovin    " Actually all the neutrals I just used the 1986 second edition infantry. Just mixed up different countries and painted them white, then the flags on the roundels. Not zoomed in 500x they actually don’t look too bad

I’m using second edition pieces for the Pro-Allied/Axis as well, Allied will be all blue, Axis all red. Same thing with the flag painted on the roundel."

I used a really dark blue for the Pro-Allied, so there isn’t any confusion with the French pieces. Red seemed to fit the Axis.

Ok, everyone, I tried out this strategy and ultimately conceded that game.  Here’s the thread if you’re interested:

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=20754.0

If you’re going to try this out, make sure Japan tries SOMETHING in S. America J3 to tie up the US for at least a few rounds.  US had like $92 for most of the game, and the Axis dropping the ball in the Atlantic/Med made it WAY too easy for the US to whup up in Europe.  Also, I played Italy like a demented retard, as the Italian BB had some awesome rolling killing TWO separate 95%+ UK attacks, and I also gave up a FREE IC in Egypt TWICE.  Don’t let the True Neutrals distract Italy, especially if you’re lucky enough to have your BB survive UK1!  Take Egypt and build/seize that IC on it!

Also, don’t throw away the German airforce in the Med trying to help the Italians, build a minor IC in Yugo and build subs or your fleet moved in from Gibraltar; I keep telling myself that every game, and every game I end up with just a few planes on the carrier by G3-4.