Importance of india

[ydavid]

Those are nice ideas Cutter. I might just try that in conjunction with a factory sometime…

[Mr. G]

Nope, bad Idea(Unless you use the Asia Wall Strategy posted somewhere here)….bad idea for a few reasons:

A. Russia NEEDS its fighters and tanks for a counterattack on the germans if not for just plain old defense on the Western front

B. Japan can easily build an IC in Kwangtung and shift all of its naval and airpower against India

C. India isn’t worth holding because when it falls there is a Jap IC 2 spaces away from Caucuses…not good…

[ydavid]

Those are nice ideas Cutter. I might just try that in conjunction with a factory sometime…

Nope, bad Idea(Unless you use the Asia Wall Strategy posted somewhere here)….bad idea for a few reasons

That’s what I was refering to with the factory in India comment, the Asian wall requires factories in Sinkiang and India, or did I miss something?

[kyrial]

That’s what I was refering to with the factory in India comment, the Asian wall requires factories in Sinkiang and India, or did I miss something?

Yeah, exactly that’s why Mr. G said bad idea unless you use Asian Wall strat. If you are going to use it, fine. But what I think he means is that if you’re going to put the IC in India you must (or at least it’s highly recommended) follow through with Asian Wall.

[Mr. G]

exactly, thanks for the clarification kyrial

[Cutter]

I was thinking of the Asian wall when I wrote that, but the original plan called for moving reinforcements in from Egypt, which would be gone by UK1 if Germany already took it out. My thought was that the Russians only stayed long enough for UK to build some units in it.

In the old AA I used to build an IC in Egypt (which only had a build value of two) as UK. Egypt was not quite as necessary a first round German target back then (no Sahara). I flew a couple FTRs in the beginning then kept only two guys a round going in (tanks had no defensive advantage over infantry back then). It always held until the US arrived to help out.

It seems that India could be similar with three builds (maybe 2 guys and a FTR). If it can be helped out the first two rounds or so.

For Sinkiang’s part of the Asian wall I was thinking of reinforcing it with 2 guys from Khazak and 2 from Novisibirsk in R1. But then all Russian forces would eventually have to leave to defend Mother Russia.

My Russian strategy has always been “Just stay alive”.

[ydavid]

Hey all,

I was only discussing building the factory as part of an Asian Wall (that’s the only reason to build any factory in Asia). Sorry not to make that more clear the first time. I think this idea has some merit, and we’ll give it a try sometime.

[othyem]

What exactly is this ‘Asian Wall’ I keep reading about. I tried searching the forums, and couldn’t find anything referring to it.

Thanks all

[Amon-Sul]

for me asian wall is th territory which the allies are holding in asia and by defending it they are in the first place defending moscow

[othyem]

@Amon-Sul:

for me asian wall is th territory which the allies are holding in asia and by defending it they are in the first place defending moscow

Is there a third part to this that involves a country north of Sinkiang? Mos likely not, as Russia would have to do it during R1.

Thanks for the insight, Amon-Sul.

[ydavid]

Sinkiang and India, both with factories which build armor to harass Japanese land units in Asia.

[Mr. G]

I posted my Asian Wall Strat on a few threads…check the one about “New British Navy” …that should help you out…

[Amon-Sul]

No Russian territories arent included as ydavid said. Beacuse for Japan player the road to moscow through the Siberia is slow, Russia doesnt lose that much ipcs and in the end its quite unlogical to attack there beacuse its logical that UK will make India in one big stronghold,and USA will try to make a base in his leftern asian territory

i dont have the game , so i can tell you the name of the territory i dont know
also i couldnt download the battle board from flames of europe

butt never mind

if you play allies,just hold the wall

until Germany or maybe Japan you never know it finally falls to its knees

[grooveman]

I haven’t seen this strategy fully implemented yet, but I’m wondering how the Allies actually win the game when using an Asian wall strat, and how hard it is to contain Germany when you’re spending so much money in Asia. Can Russia really hold off the Germans?

[kyrial]

I haven’t seen this strategy fully implemented yet, but I’m wondering how the Allies actually win the game when using an Asian wall strat, and how hard it is to contain Germany when you’re spending so much money in Asia. Can Russia really hold off the Germans?

Well, it really isn’t spending THAT much money in Asia… it IS spending more than one might normally spend but let’s look at it from a purely statistical point of view: for those who have played a decent amount of games, I think we can agree that a key for the Axis is Japan ransacking Asia. Germany alone can go one-on-one with Russia but by turn 2 or 3 (at the VERY latest) the UK is pumping troops into Russia to help with defense and the USA has taken back Africa. With Russia strafing German troop buildups it’s only a matter of time before Germany starts to feel the economic heat, especially if either the USA or UK (or both!) also starts an SBR campaign even if it’s not all out… just enough to keep Germany from stacking.

The key to the vast majority of games is Japan vs. Russia. Japan has to put tremendous pressure on Russia from the East in order to stop Russia from being able to bring its full strength (admittedly not a whole lot but enough) on Germany. Without the Asian territories, Japan is in a lot of trouble economically plus besides which they will have a fun time slogging through Russia proper from Buryatia on the long way to Moscow.

Thus Asian Wall, if properly implemented, will give Africa to Germany if the latter wishes it (which can even be defended on US1) but will slow down/ stop the Japanese attack. Even spending money in Asia, the US can bring about a tremendous force on Germany within a few turns and the UK can keep pumping troops into Russia to aid in the defense.

Yes, we’re still going with a KGF overall strat, but I think Asian Wall slows Japan down enough to allow Germany to go down even faster plus it forces Germany to make some risky moves because Germany usually just tries to hold out until Japan can bring the uber-Economy and forces to bear on Russia.

[justus]

I agree with Kyrial. It’s primarily Japan’s job to take out Moscow. The Russians can match anything Germany can muster on the Eastern front, plus the Nazis also have to hold their own against ensuing Allied landings (ya know, the whole surrounded on all sides thing). Consequently, a good Asian Wall strategy will buy the Rusky’s some time, so it’s worth it to expend some resources on IC’s and the like. Look, there are only three ways into Russia from the east: the frozen north (Soviet Far East, Buraytia, Yakut), China, the Caucasus and Kazak SSR (through India, Persia and Trans-Jordan). Putting roadblocks in these three areas will only help the Allies. Considering the fact that the Axis’ only viable strategy is to KUSSRF (which is again Japan’s job), stopping Japan is a good idea.

[ZimZaxZeo]

Mr. G:
A. Russia NEEDS its fighters and tanks for a counterattack on the germans if not for just plain old defense on the Western front

B. Japan can easily build an IC in Kwangtung and shift all of its naval and airpower against India

C. India isn’t worth holding because when it falls there is a Jap IC 2 spaces away from Caucuses…not good…

Mr. G, you and the other posters here all have some good ideas. But I have seen some different outcomes, depending on a range of outcomes.
I don’t have much experience with Revised, but we do have a 5-player game going using LHTR 1.1 (Larry Harris Tournament Rules) and the Brits got Colonial Garrison for their NA – we each got one NA. Anyway, regarding your points
A: Russia has been able to help retake and hold the IC in India, and even launch an attack into FIC, and still balance the Germans into a stalemate (at least through G4). All this without the US contributing an IC in Sinkiang. In other words, we Allies have only half an Asian Wall, and it has been working.

B: Because we have given Japan so much trouble with India, and kept his forces very thin in China and FIC, he hasn’t risked building that IC in Kwangtung. Maybe he will on J4, but then forces built there couldn’t threaten Moscow until J9! If it wasn’t for the UK forces coming from that India IC, helped by Russian armor, he probably could have plunked in a Kwangtung IC quicker.

C. India can be worth retaking, reinforcing and holding, because: once Germany has been eliminated from Middle East, then India can form the strong point on the southern flank for Russia – helping secure Caucasus and forcing the Japanese to plow up the middle. And typically Japan will have already burned a bunch of forces trying to take India (that AAGun took out 2Ftrs so far), so even without another Allied IC in the middle, his Asian offensive will be lighter.

Anyway what’s great about AAR is the incredible flexibility and all the options. Not to mention those 3-3 tanks! A much better investment now, and less reason to hold them back from attacking, even for Russia.

[grooveman]

I’m sure it could work well. It just seems like a waste of resources to me to go with an Asian Wall; plus Japan will eventually take those complexes. If you invest resources in the Atlantic, then the UK should have no problem funneling in troops and fighters to RUS to help hold off the Japanese down the road, and have many more strategic options in the meantime. And Germany is likely completely screwed if the Allies go all out against Germany. I just feel that if you let the Jap’s rush toward MOS and the Allies rush towards Berlin, the Allies will beat them there. I need to try the asian wall sometime and see how it goes. Or face one from someone that knows what they’re doing. Then again, I rarely allow the UK to keep EGY after turn 1.