Axis and Allies victory 101 (basicly how to win)

[Commissar Adam]

yes 8)

also you cannot withstand the mass soviet mobilization plus the harsh russian winter :x

[cystic crypt]

@ZimZaxZeo:

Commissar Adam:

Zer iss a much zafer vay to make mit der shtrategic mitdrawals, yah!

it’s “das” shtrategic mitdrawals, not “der”
8)

[ZimZaxZeo]

Acchh!! Zounds like you iss giffink me das boot!!

Was tut man in dem Fall?

[tnegiet]

I think that has been the basic war strategy since the begining of time…never fight a two front war! Unfortunately (or fortunately) in A&A your enemy should determine if your strategy will succeed.

[Bruce Lee]

i agree with you on this one commissar adam (you give good advice :D ), this is very similar to my main startagy as any nation. my start has nothing to do with particular units or countries, as u have to decide on those as the game progress’. i relay on 2 basic rules.

both these are considering that, whatever the battle,
it is equal probability (although this almost never
happens, it just makes things easier to pretend).

1. variaty works. a multitude of guys with different hit numbers works (ie. inf + tanks on offense, not on defense). the math behind this one is that, if u and you opponent both lose the same amount of guys, but he has all the same (like defense hit 2) then after every round of rolls u gain a bigger advatage. if he has to lose a guy thats just as valuable then the rest, and u can lose a guy that is less valuable, like losing inf as fodder, u will one up him. retreating works well with this as well, like your conga line strat. when i use a strat like that though i like to use a couple fighters as well so that when i retreat, if my opponent can counter, i have some varying defense with the fighters. i know that this is pretty basic and simple, but it works. what works well about it is that there is nothing set about it and it can vary depending on the situation.

2. power in numbers. again this is saying odds are even. this is similar to the first one and works well with it. if the odds are equal but you have quantity against there quality, you have the advantage. an example of this would be attacking with 6 inf against 3 defending inf. the odds are equal, first round you should each lose 1, but from then on u have a growing advantage. again this was pretty basic information but, hey, it works.

these end up making something VERY similar to your strat, so i guess this was a pointless rant… YAY

[cystic crypt]

that captures the zen of A&A offensives quite nicely my friend.

[Guest]

Surely by fighting until losing tanks and then not taking the territory you are presented with some serious problems; Germany will almost certainly have more tanks than you, higher starting rate, higher production. By retreating you leave him with tanks, and possibly even men if your retreat is based solely on your losses. Germany is also likely to have more fighters and bombers. Withdrawing after losing a tank or two means you will have no infantry left to soak up hits [unless your casualty removal system is ‘interesting’ or you are lucky enough to have a factory in the territory]. This means when the Germans counter, which in most cases would be a good idea, they will have more tanks, with higher chances of hitting than your defending tanks and planes most likely of both types. The chances of holding the territory are low if Germany press for the victory which would be wise considering the production bonus and the fact that you couldn’t hit into German lands for another turn, so they can replace losses. Any pressure from the East, if Japans continental lands aren’t over-run by an Asia-happy Brit [as I like to play], and Russia will be in serious trouble. Russia should obviously mount a first turn assault [if allowed] and then try and hold out for Allied support and pressure. Then again that may only work in the group I play with. GOdd luck.

[Bruce Lee]

the thing is hewlett, if were talking about russia (which we are) then its likely were talking about this stratagie as karelia. probably karelia to eastern Eu.
therefor there is a IC there. the reason we attack untill would lose tanks, or even better fighters, is because you are trying your hardest not to lose tanks/fighters. so when u retreat u place down, lets say, 9 inf, your left with a great defensive force to defend your more valuable units. also, if u have any fighter with you, you now have one of the best defens’ in the game. frankly, i welcome the counter-attack. you should also be able to rely on your 2 allies that go after germany. hopefully they are either startegic bombing running him a tank or 2 worth of IPC’s, or they are weakening the german force that has come in to reinforce the country u were attacking. example: if u were attacking eastern Eu. and u were left with 2 tanks, 3 fighters, when u retreat to karelia (plus placing 10 inf), and he is left with 2 tanks. if he counter attacks from germany with 6 more tanks (making 8 tanks) he is going to die, or more likely, will retreat back to eastern. either way it was a stupid move to counter. even if he does retreat with some forces after reallizing his mistake, on of your allies should use some planes to kill, or hurt, those forces, if not amphibious assault. either way, hopefully youll be able to walk in a good defensive force. if u dont have a good defensive force though, it may be better to take it with one infentry and prepare to attack when he takes it back (this way u dont lose much but germany cant blitz). as russia its important to remember that its not your job to kill germany, even if thats what happens at the end. russia is allied with two much slower starting countries. if the axis can finish off russia quickly, then they usually win (economic victory, even if not tey become to powerful). its russias job to slow down the axis untill your allies can help, mainly, USA. if russia tries to kill germany right away, without the allies being there to support him, he will lose and the axis will counter (usually) and win. thats why strategic retreats work really well with russia. it lets u keep germany in a virtual standstill, and also lets u keep your big units and buy only inf every turn. infantry are russias best friend.

[Bruce Lee]

oh, and CC, thanks :D. i think it is a great zen way of putting A&A offensive.

[Blitzkrieg]

I have been debating this with my brother-in-law for a while now. He feels that a defensive strategy with the Soviets works best. I feel otherwise simply because the Germans can outspend them for the fist few turns therefore building up an army large enough to smash through the Soviet defenses. I think the Soviets HAVE to attack and be aggressive simply because the Soviets don’t have all that much territory to trade for time. I think it’s a foolish strategy to allow the German army to get overly powerful while the Soviet army just sits there and does nothing. The Soviets have to whittle the Germans down in a war of attrition while the other allies build up forces powerful enough to take Western Europe. Another thing we disagree on: I think the British should build an industrial complex in India on the first turn. If the Soviet player is aggressive and take Manchuria on the first turn (I usually do this with the forces in the Soviet Far East and Yakut S.S.R. augmented with one fighter from Russia, this is almost a sure victory for the Soviets) then Japan has to focus on retaking Manchuria and this diverts forces away from possible attacks into Sinkiang and India. I sometimes will also build an industrial complex in China for the U.S. too if Japan builds one in Kwangtung on their turn. This may constitute a beat Japan first strategy but it usually works, even when the Japanese bulid a factory in Kwangtung. My brother-in-law insists this won’t work but I think if the Japanese have to retake Manchuria on Turn One then it’s very difficult to take India unless the Japanese player wants to fight on equal terms which is actually at his disadvantage since the infantry and fighter there defend at higher rolls than the attacking Japanese forces. In Europe I keep building transports and attacking Western Europe to distract German forces from the Russian front. This strategy might not seem very good to more experienced players (I only get to play once a month at best and went almost five years without playing at all) but it works a lot of the time unless i get some bad rolls in key battles. My brother-in-law plays constantly but I think I can beat him doing this…well I’ll find out next week when I visit him in Tennessee. I’m not sure what his strategy is, but I do know that I almost beat him the one time we did play, but this was before I came up with this strategy…tell me what you think.

[Bruce Lee]

i agree with u that in a regular game russia should take maunchuria (they dont even eed the fighter most of the time) and russia should attack germany first turn (any of the 3 german terretories are good targets, depending on stratagie). the problem is that, in doing this, the allies win about 80% of the time (between experienced players). the only way axis can win is if they’re super agressive right off the start. if they wait to long america, with their vast resources, will get heavily into the war and the axis will simply be outnubered. thats why experienced players play by modified rules. the main thing is that russia is restricted and is not allowed to attack first turn. that means russia cant attack manchuria OR germany. also, all te players make a bid to see who will play axis. the lowest bid plays germany and may add units to the board depending on how much they bid. by these rules the game is alot more fair and axis/allies win/loss ratio becomes about 50% percent for each side. for example: a good bid for the axis is 8 ipc. this means, if the lowest bidder was 8 ipc, that person would play the axis, and could add 8 IPC’s worth of units to any of his/her territories. (armor + infantry, transport, sub… etc.) also since russia cant attack, their only option is to stack defence, usually karelia. as u can see this gives the axis a much better chance.
hope this helps u to understand why we make all these crazy first moves as russia, and why an indian IC is questionable.
if u start playing with these rules, its important to remember that, when bidding, u bid enough to get something good from the bid, but u dont bid so high that they can get axis with alot as well. if u want to play axis, a bid of 7-8 is good, u will probably get it, and if not, they lose the advantage of bidding. if u dont want to play axis, bid 9-10. that way, if u get it for some reason, u get a big advantage.
hope this all helps, and good luck against your uncle.

[GeZe]

attack germany first turn? what about RR

[Bruce Lee]

ya. because hes not playing RR. i think…
i think its something like that. … AHH
hey, where did u get that quote? i love it

[GeZe]

I got the quote from"Stupid White Men"

[Blitzkrieg]

Thanks for the tips, but where can I find revised rules? What about a non-aggression pact between Japan and the U.S.S.R.? What the hell is a bid? LOL The group I play with has considered a few rule changes in the past to balance things out a bit but since we play so infrequently no one has taken much time to think them out. If I can find some rules someplace it would be a bit easier.

[Commissar Adam]

hey guys nice to see yall again after the long vacation
and thanks bruce lee for defending my strats while I was gone
also blitzkrieg was saying how a defensive strategy was best for russia and this style of defense. If you can russia slowly eats up territories if germanys defense is weak enough

also someone was saying how germany has more tanks to attack russia with BUT, my tactics are used to cripple german offense and if they do want to attack it will be with tanks, bombers, and fighters that have no infantry support :roll:
Now do you think you can really afford to take ALL of you losses on these expensive units :-?

yeah I thought so 8)

[Commissar Adam]

annyone have a good reply :roll:

[Commissar Adam]

I think that I should start a new post. This one has seemed to lose its pizzaz, no one is stirring up the contreversy that it once did. Maybe I’ll start one called “Axis and Allies 102” either way I’ll most likely start a new one, this one was fun. 8)

[Guest]

It’s dangerous to just assume that any specific or even general strategy will work all the time or even most of the time. Even though Axis and Allies does have certain “tendencies” of play, the best strategists, tacticians, and generals will always find ways to defeat those tendencies. The only truly general principles apply to all wargames, not just A&A:

1. The Cardinal Rule: War never guarntees anything. Therefore, any strategy or tactic that is invented is never guarnteed to work 100% of the time.

2. None of the following rules may or will apply in any and all situations.

3. Outguess your opponent. Chess grand masters visualize the game several moves ahead, trying to figure out what they will do, how their opponent will respond, and vice versa. Thinking a step or two ahead of your opponent is generally a good idea.

4. Adapt to changing situations. You may do something based on what your opponent seems to be preparing to do. He may then do something entirely different and throw you off balance. How well you adapt to what your opponent this did may determine whether you live or die.