Well that’s the rub. “as long as by the end of the turn the stacking limits are obeyed” is not as easy as it seems. If at the end of the turn a hex IS overstacked, you have got some pretty weird stuff to resolve that.
Mot
Here’s an example I’vedon a dozen times:
With these new rules, you cannot start the game with your 88 or Bofors loaded on a transport, move to a drop location on turn 1, and dismount it.
To resolve the vehicle overstack you have to back out the last one in, as per the new rules. Last one in is the Bofors gun, which then magically teleports back onto the Truck to resolve the overstack.
How is that not broken!?
Well, that depends on how one interprets the rules.
My call would be that any of the previous ‘if ti breaks the stacking limit’ rules, like dismounting in an adjacent hex, continue to work as before (or at least there is the option to keep them working as before) even if technically now they do not break the stacking limit until the end of the turn.
I guess the question is: Is loading the 88 on a transport at the start of a scenario a desirable behavior or an exploit?
I agree though, that these new stacking rules need a whole lot of clarifications to work right. And since I have yet to see any read advantage to my gaming experience when using them, I am inclined to use the old rules for now.
Motdc,
I take exception to the term broken. Everything in life is in transition including these rules. Of course it would be great if they were pefectly sorted out when we first bought into the game but we’d still be waiting for the game.
I’m not privy to WotC politics but I’m sure the game designers are doing their best to keep the game on the rails. Solutions will be easier to find when the suggestions for change are more positive.
Audacity
I complain here, I posted an excellently positive suggestion over there…no worries :mrgreen:
Though I disagree that the the rules were intended to be some type of work-in-progress. Rules are rules, and I take them very seriously. They were not posted with a “here’s a proposed idea”…they were posted as “here are the new rules”
Well, that depends on how one interprets the rules.
My call would be that any of the previous ‘if ti breaks the stacking limit’ rules, like dismounting in an adjacent hex, continue to work as before (or at least there is the option to keep them working as before) even if technically now they do not break the stacking limit until the end of the turn.
Ah, but the rules state you can only deploy adjacnet when you would otherwise break the stacking rule. And since the stacking rule isnt broken until the end of the phase, that criteria is not met.
I did very simply and plainly ask for a clarification of this one point. I’ll let you all know when I hear an official answer.
Great. All they have to do is rule that for purposes of unloading troops, ‘breaking the stacking limit’ can be checked at the moment of unloading instead of the end of the turn, if the acting player chooses to.
Although, they may have other intentions, like closing the unloading in an overloaded hex to gain an extra hex worth of movement loophole.
Yes you are right, that too was an objective U believe. But they traded a well known and fairly contained “loop-hole” (which I actually didnt think caused any game imbalance issues or rules contradictions) for a problem of a different color.
As always, just my 2 cents!
Mot
I’m not privy to WotC politics but I’m sure the game designers are doing their best to keep the game on the rails. Solutions will be easier to find when the suggestions for change are more positive.
This was my suggestion for fixing the Large Artillery issue instead of changing the stacking resolution rules:
“Large - This unit may not end its Move or Assualt in a hex with a vehicle unless it has the Transport ability. Vehicles may not end their Move or Assualt in a hex with this unit unless that vehicle has the Transport ability”.
If they want to allow swappimg units then I suggest they just explicitly allow it:
“Two adjacents Soldiers that are eligible to Move may effectively swap positions. This is considered to two simultaneous Moves on the part of the Soldiers, and is subject to Defensive Fire, movement rolls, etc. If either Soldier is prevented from moving (due to a Defensive Fire disruption for example) then both units are prevented from moving.”
If they want to prevent the “overstack flick” then they should just disallow it, point blank. “You may not unload into an overstacked hex.” And with the new 3-units-per-hex AND my suggestion for Large artillery, you would be far less likely to bump into this limit.
As always, these are just my opinions!
bump for new players
I don’t know about all the new rules. There’s something to be said about simplicity. We’ve adapted “overwatch” into our game but we’re still playing with the same rules with a couple minor variations that just speed up the game play and make it more fun.
BTW –- Since “Overwatch” is a play on defensive fire, this means that a tank on overwatch cannot shoot at soldiers that move into its row right? I figure it’s true since vehicles don’t get defensive fire on soldiers. Just want clarification if you guys don’t mind.
Overwatch is not an official rule, its optional. Be careful not to confuse the “Expanded Rules” (optional) with the new Revised rules update (which is really only 3 or 4 rules adjustements).
Mot
