Operation Sealion a Possibility with AA1940 Europe?

You think that France is going to fall that easily? Didn’t they have troops in Africa

@idk_iam_swiss:

You think that France is going to fall that easily? Didn’t they have troops in Africa

Larry said France will fall regardless, it just might take an extra turn if the dice arent on your side.

Yeah from the sound of it they will fall by turn 2 unless you deliberately avoid conflict with them.

@idk_iam_swiss:

You think that France is going to fall that easily? Didn’t they have troops in Africa

It won’t be a cake walk, but yea I think France will loose the Paris tt, and the French coast tt rd #1. The Paris  tt should border West Germany (ouch), and the French coastal tt should boarder the low countries that will start out in German hands. The full blitzkrieg (tanks/tacs) should overwhelm the French (pending dice). I also think the Germans will have some inf on the front as well.  Italy should be able to come in and take southern France (Vichy) on it first turn as well. The scattered French units in Africa will be more of a nuisance then anything just backing up UK (they can’t replenish). Same with the starting French fleet, I see it as a shell of what it actually was. I would expect the (allied) French fleet to reflect the reduction due to the UK attacking it, and much of it kept in port or scuttled.

Now that we know that the US or Russia can’t attack the Euro axis until rd #4 (unless provoked). The UK is really the only main focus. Japan wipes out China, Germany/Italy wipes out France. Then its UK’s turn.

Yea you have to make sure that you keep enough troops on the Russian boarder, but as the axis you can take your enemies to their knees one at a time. You almost have to attempt a Sea Lion, there is no one else to fight. You must at the very least kick them out of strategic areas, like the Med, Middle East, and Africa, but you can’t take a pass at London if it doable. This might be a kill UK first, then go for India once everyone is at war. Saying that, however, if UK falls its not game over, US/Russia will be powerhouses, but you have to take advantage of the delay for them to enter the game.

UK’s strategy will be as it is in Pac 40 (India), stay alive as long as you can and wait for your friends to bail you out (RD #4). The only difference is they will have more units, and may be able to delay the inevitable long enough for their allies to prevent their destruction. Either that or enough time to setup a quick liberation that they could be a part of.

Okay France is gone. UK, USSR and China are waiting for a bail out. That is going to make things rough on the US.

Yep, that’s pretty much what happened :-D  If Japan hadn’t attacked Pearl/Philippines who knows? I think we would have figured some way to get our hands dirty though at some point.

@WILD:

Yep, that’s pretty much what happened :-D  If Japan hadn’t attacked Pearl/Philippines who knows? I think we would have figured some way to get our hands dirty though at some point.

I am sure they already were dirty.

You wouldn’t necessarily have to hold UK after a successful Sea Lion strategy. The added income and the loss of UK income from taking the capitol would go a long way.

@SgtBlitz:

Just wondering how these were going to fit into the global picture…  May be best for Axis to go after Russia first since it will have the least amt of units/firepower with the most easily available resources AND it won’t activate the US war dec.  Thinking there might be a SOVIET war economy that gets activated upon invasion, that might be interesting change to game.

That probably depends on the amount of starting units that Germany has at its disposal G1. Germany must be able to defeat France quickly without having to depend to much on lucky dice. So perhaps a G2, G3 attack on Russia is more viable.

An attack on Russia G1 all the while the Battle of France is still raging would also mean more or less ignoring the UK, right?

We now know Russia can’t attack the Euro axis til rd #4 (unless provoked). I believe it could go to war w/Jap at any time as there is no pact or rule to stop them (but will they want to?). There will be several pro (something) neutrals near the Russian boarders, will they be able to take them? The first couple of rounds will most likely see Germany, Italy and UK gobble them up, but will Russia be in on the fun (it has the 2nd turn).

I don’t see a large build-up at the boarder for the Germans/Russians. The Germans will need a rd or two to maneuver/build for a Barbarossa. They can do this as they destroy France, but will need to build more tanks from the beginning and reposition their air force after France Paris falls (the loot will come in handy). The Russians will be in def mode from the beginning on the Euro front, because they won’t be able to attack until rd #4 unless provoked (maybe Italy can screw this up). The Soviets will likely set up a week front line w/counter attack in position to kill the German front line tanks. There is also a lot of tt the Russians can make def withdraw through until they gain an advantage over a bogged down axis.

As I said I don’t think there will be a pact between Russia and Japan preventing them from going to war (per Larry), and both powers will have large forces on the boarders. We already know what Japan has, and I think Larry said something about 18 Russian units there. In a nut shell it would be costly to both of them to attack. The Japs will want to use that force to take out China & eventually UK, and the Russians I’m sure would like to bring the Siberians home to protect Moscow. It will be cool to see if they allow each other to withdraw, or if they will have to keep those large forces at least near the boarder. If Germany goes all out against Russia rd #3, I could easily see the Japs coming from the other way.

If you go full tilt against Russia early (rd #2-#3), I just think your letting UK off the hook. Once UK gets the full support of the US, it will be a very tough nut to crack. Russia/US can’t hurt you til round #4 (at your control), and the UK is isolated. Sea Lion may be to costly, but control of the sea’s around UK, the Med, Scandinavia, and much of the Mid East/Africa will be a pretty big axis advantage early on. If the opportunity comes up and you can take London even temporarily, it will set the allies back.

@SgtBlitz:

I’m not saying stop the invasion of France, just that there’s not much point in weakening Britain overmuch if you can’t take the capital.  You’re just throwing expensive air and naval units at boats the UK can rebuild, over and over again (lol maybe hoping for paratroopers to roll).

Sea Lion may be determined to be to costly of a move (due to naval build-up needed). We won’t know til the game comes out in late Aug for sure to see what the starting German navy is. You still have an isolated UK that the Euro axis can double team for 3-4 rounds, how often can the axis do that. Its normally the other way around. If you can attack expensive UK/French ships w/cheap subs/DD’s and an over powering air force, you have to go for it. Control of the sea is very important to the axis Euro’s even if its just the first 4-5 rounds. If you are able to reduce the UK income to just the island (8-10 ipc’s) in Europe, and also not allowing the UK to get its NO, by taking most of its Euro assets that’s a rather large axis advantage. You know that parts of the UK (French) fleet(s) will be sitting ducks at the games start (it always is).

**Edit: Plus if you have control of the sea around England you don’t necessarily have to take the capital to further reduce its income, there are convoy zones. You may be able to reduce UK to just the Canadian ipc’s w/o taking London. Of course this will only work until the US comes over, but that could take awhile, and major US involvement in Europe could be better for a patient Japan.

I say strip what you can from UK rd 1-3, then start the invasion of Russia rd #3 at the earliest before they get to powerful. I wonder what the best round will be for Japan to start its invasions rd #3 as well?

The political rules will make things interesting. I think so and frankly they were necessary. To not have included them in a 1940 start date game would have not been fulfilling and realistic at all. Unfortunately, they have caused some issues. Russia should start out as neutral vs the Euro axis, It does… but does it start out neutral vs Jap, sounds like they will. I have left this to the Japanese and Russian player to figure out between themselves. I think it’s kind of fun to have a bit of unpredictability on that front. I once conducted a big Japanese, basically an air attack, against a consolidated Russian position of some 18 infantry and never recovered as Japan. No surprise for sure, but it drove home that Russia is no pushover on that front and Japan is rather motivated to keep the peace. Also sounds like Russia/Jap can declare war on each other at any time, or not at all. That’s pretty much the case. However, it is important to point out that Russia cannot attack a Euro Axis until its turn 4. This is not to say that it can’t be at war with the Euro Axis before that moment. That depends on whether or not they are attacked by them.… Just because Russia is at war w/Germany, doesn’t necessarily mean it will be at war w/Japan. And like wise, just because Russia is at war with German and/or Italy doesn’t mean that its a war with Japan. They both (Japan and Russia) have good reasons to not mess with each other – at least not until their other pressing problems are resolved one way or the other. I would think that if Russian units move into UK/Chinese tt they would first have to declare war on Japan (like UK moving into China). In addition to normal restrictions, the Soviet Union may not move units into China (until at war with Japan of course). I also would think that if UK/Jap go to war (regardless who starts it) Russia will still have the option to stay out. It does…

Larry am I close on this, could you shed some light? I think I just did, will maybe I did.

Edit: Also if Russia is at war w/Germany will UK units be able to move into Russia, or will that also be an act of war against Jap for Russia to open her boarders? No this would not be an act of war against Japan by Russia or the UK. I’m not totally clear on this point anymore. Krieghund is the only person in the world who seems to know the definitive answers to these political basket of crabs questions. I think we should ask him (confirmed by Krieghund). :wink: In any case, the Russians and the Japanese can go to war for what ever reason they see fit. There ain’t nothing stopping em.

This is a Q & A I had w/Larry in early April. I’m not sure if Russia gets those 18 inf from the start in one tt (Amur), or where they are. I would imagine that they could be scattered about in Siberia, but could be consolidated quickly. With what Japan starts out with in Manchuria, Russia should have a pretty good deterrent.

@SgtBlitz:

Gleh, too much red text.

What is this the Book of Wild Bill in the New A&A Testament? Does he think he is our personal A&A savior?

@Brain:

@SgtBlitz:

Gleh, too much red text.

What is this the Book of Wild Bill in the New A&A Testament? Does he think he is our personal A&A savior?

It’s the words of Harris in Red edition.