Hidden subs

Some optional play for 1914 fans.

Modified rule 12/22/17 to denote that 8 markers are given to each side for play.

1914_German_sub_patrols.jpg

Too bad.
1914 players deserve a place of their own to read all related threads more easily.

I’m pretty sure some players would find many interesting ideas and an easier access than to read them than scrolling through this mess or using Google search which 50% of time bring up pages which have a different interface than regular blue colored forum pages.

I’m usually scrolling until I found  a link starting with www.org…., but sometimes it doesn’t work.
So, I have to check the date of the last quote and make a guess about which pages of this forum it is until I find it. Takes sometimes 10 to 15 minutes, other time I abandoned and try different keywords expecting that a www.org… will appear.

I just have a problem sinking a piece without even rolling a dice.
Same thing here.
You must rolling die to sink a warship escorted or not.

The only long range sortee by unescorted battleships that I have ever heard of are the German convoy raiders of WW II. I just feel that there should be some penalty for a player doing such a foolish thing in AA. Maybe a one shot attack and then submerge is enough.

Either subs attacking unescorted capitol warships get 1 roll, if a 1-2 ship sunk on 1st hit. if sub misses,sub is considered submerged,breaks off attack,but if it stays in sea zone to try again next turn or follows same shipsinto another sea zone to try again next turn, destroyer and cruisers detection roll is upped to 1-4 becouse sub is known to be activly prowling area.

Well if a player let his warship alone, it could be destroyed.
Sub must continue his attack after the first round of combat or warship alone can escape after the first round. - But I prefer the first option-.

HI A&A Gamers!  8-)

I just made a little resume about sub-pens, because after many hours of research about them, i think that clarification must be done about this great building. Thanks for the xeno forum, ive take many info here

enjoy!

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Sub-Pens ( may also be called U-Boat Pens) (based on Xeno world at war 2005 4Th.) The Best Rule!

The battle for the Atlantic and the German U-Boat offensive take on a new dimension as German subs hunt the Atlantic for British/U.S. merchant shipping and do steadily increasing IPC damage to the British war economy. Britain has to scramble to develop radar technology and set up a well positioned force to contain and counter the German U-boat menace. The sub pens provide a safe haven for German subs to sally forth from, do economic damage, and return to without much danger of being sunk in their protective pens.

Pens will play a key role, providing a safe place for subs to hide, which becomes important because of sub’s ability to convoy hunt. On the German player’s turn he can send his subs out on patrol to hunt convoys, do some damage to the British economy, and then scoot them back into the pen. The pens are a big headache for the British player and normally require a multi turn bombing campaign to get rid of (first the British player has to destroy French industry and Germany’s ability to replace the pens on France’s coast, then the British player can focus on taking out the pens themselves).

By Mike Xeno

Sub-pens are special fortified defensives buildings that protect submarines from air and sea attack by sheltering them. Germany (or all other players if you want) may produce sub-pens at a cost of 8 IPCs each. Sub-pens must be built in a sea zone adjacent to a land zone with an industrial complex, just like all naval units. The player may build any number of pens, but only one in a single sea area. Sub-pens may not move.

Submarines may be placed in sub-pens in order to help defend them from attacking aircraft. They may hold an amount of 2 subs maximum (optional rule: you can set an unlimited number). Sub-pens are treated as a “sea zone within a sea zone” (separate sea zone). When in the same sea zone as a sub-pen, submarines may move into or out of the sub-pen without any movement cost at any time during player’s turn. Newly built sub-pens can have subs on the board placed into them right away, and newly built subs can be placed immediately in a pen that is already on the board. Subs in a pen cannot choose to defend the sea zone of this pen.

Sub-pens are only vulnerable to air attack (They never take damage from naval units). Any other friendly or enemy ships have no effect on attacking, defending, etc with regards to the sub pen. Any friendly ships in the same sea zone can be attacked separately. The pen has a permanent A/A capacity that is used (and only be used) against attacking aircraft. The pen defends in combat just like a normal A/A gun, except when attacked by aircraft, sub-pen defend by rolling 3 dices (no matter the number of attacking aircraft) each round, with each roll of 1-2 scoring a hit. During an air attack on a sub-pen, submarines in a pen are considered automatically detected but they may choose to withdraw/submerge after each round of combat. Hits on a sub-pen hit the subs in the pen first, then the pen itself once all the subs are destroyed. Sub-pens also require two hits to be destroy, not just one. A damaged sub-pen defends on a 1 instead of a 2 and costs 3 IPCs to repair. If an enemy force conquers a territory with a sub-pen, that pen is destroyed and removed from play.

Resume

a) Roll 3 dices for the pen (no matter the number of attacking aircraft). Hit on a 2 or less.
b) Remove casualties for attacker (fighters and/or bombers.)
c) Roll dice for planes.
d) Remove casualties for defender (the subs is hit first/then calculated two hits for the sub-pen).
e) Subs may withdraw/submerge. (Follow standard Axis and Allies rules.)
f) Planes may retreat.
g) Next round of combat. Repeat step a)

Faqs:

Question:

Sub-pens have A/A capability. May they defend just in the case of an air attack against the pen or also in the case of over flight?

Answer:

Only in an attack on the pen. The pen doesn’t cover the global sea area, only the pen him-self.

Question:

It said pens have no zone of control. Does this mean I can attack a naval zone with a pen adjacent and just fight the units in the sea zone and not the ones from the pen?

Answer:

Yes, and the subs in the pen never support the units in the naval zone. Example: Germany has a sub pen with 2 subs in it on France, and a cruiser (all in the same sea zone). Britain decides to attack the sea zone with 2 battleships and a sub. Britain attacks only the cruiser. Germany defends with only the cruiser (the subs cannot assist). Britain may not attack the German sub pen and subs within it with its ships.

Question:

If I build subs in a pen may they be initially placed just in the pen or directly in the adjacent sea zone?

Answer:

Your choice.

Question:

Do I have to spend a movement point for transfer a sub (into/ out) a pen adjacent sea zone?

Answer:

No.

Question:

I thought that sub pens prevented subs from a naval attack, as sub pens themselves are given the same protection. That would mean the only way to kill a sub in a sub pen would be to risk an aerial attack?

Answer:

A sub-pen needs to be taken out with aerial attack or, it is destroyed if the land area it is attached to is captured by the enemy.

If something in this briefing seem wrong or bad, say it! and leave any suggestion or idea!  :-D

ty and have a good game!

Frank

under my files i made these. They are all public files under mediafire

escort = different kind of destroyer.
In our rule we have…
Escort =
move 2
att 1
def 2
cost 8

destoyer =
move = 2
att = 2
def 2
cost 10

Only escort and destroyer can attack sub.

@Gallo:

I’ve read a lot about how annoying is that just one destroyer can cancel the special capacities of any giving number of subs.
I don’t find that very problematic myself

its not hugely problematic
just looks funny to have one destroyer tagging along a huge fleet

but some players suggest that you should match one destroyer with one sub for canceling subs capacities.

but what about this: one destroyers cancels the capacities of a wolf-pack of three subs… the fourth sub (and the next ones) still have their special abilities.

yeah the one-for-one rule is nicely intuitive
(because of original ruleset’s one-for-one bonus for infantry+artillery)

maybe you could make it simple and just make the wolf-pack cancelling 1-to-1 too?

@Imperious:

heres some manageable rules to use:

I most like the part about destroyer and crusier negate submarine’s preemptive fire on a 1-to-1 basis (rather than unlimited in AAR).

Simple enough to implement for even first time players. Yet quite effective in improving gameplay dynamics.