Seperation of Church and State

@yourbuttocks:

We suck at Math, Fisternis? Where did John Nash live? Where is MIT, JPL, Los Alamos, etc. located?

don’t forget La Jolla, Princeton, etc.

Exactly. The list goes on and on.

Most non-statistic theorem are not english, and Jonh Nash does not work a lot on pure mathematic, more on application. If you go on analyse & geometry, you will find out that most basic theorem are not english. Also i did’nt say American were dumm in math, but;

1; That is cleary not your stength
2; There is not a lot of american innovation in math
3; You score very bad in math test.

Sure Nash’s equilibrium theory was not idiot; but it was for application, it is a theorem base on induction, more statistic than mathematic. I don’t see any Hilbert, Gauss, Lobatchevshi, Riemann, Poincaré, Legendre or Lagrange in America.

I don’t know why you are taking this seriously, no country is perfect, all have + & -.

“Moses, what is French Pizza? And you know that French fries were invented in America, right? And so I blelieve French toasst, though I am not sure.”

Can I answer my brother’s question? I hope he doesn’t get toooo mad at me. :roll: French pizza is similar to regular pizza, but with different ingredients and rectangular shape. French fries original did come from France. A nice little story was that American doughboys were the first to experience ‘French Fries’ during their stay in France. After the Armistice was signed, many of the troops shipped home complained about the lack of any ‘French Fries.’ Thus, the French Fry was born. I’m unsure if this story is a hundred percent correct, as there has been some disputes between the origins Belgium Fries and French Fries.

I would like to say, after glancing at these messages, there seems to be a bit of an anti-French outlook. Where did this come from? France is a very beautiful country, and one day I would like to visit it again. Paris, the City of Lights, is absolutely gorgeous and stunning beyond words. French are all very smart, and their Enlightened Thinkers like Voltaire, Diderot, Montesquieu, and Rousseau pioneered intellectual thought. The French have excelled at philosophy, the sciences, mathematics, and literature. If not for the French, there might not have been a Democratic Republic we have today in America. I hope to take European Studies in high school to learn more about their history and culture. :)

“anti-french outlook”

But MOM, they started it!

“French are all very smart”

I’m sure every single Frenchman is a genius. Lol

I have nothing against the French, and neither does anyone else here (except for Crypt, but those Canadians are all around belligerent. :))
We Americans simply take exception from being called stupid religious fanatics.

“If not for the French, there might not have been a Democratic Republic we have today in America”

That would be true, except american ideas of democracy and republic are more British(Locke) and Roman (Republic) and Greek (Athens) than French (Montisque). Besides, the French tried to create a republic, following American lead, and it resulted in bloodshed plus decades of war.

Besides, Fisternis, what French Mathematicians put a man on the moon?

aside from my one Frenchman joke, i’m still trying to figure out why i’m the “French-hater”. I even studied the stupid language for 12 years, built several excellent relationships with French people (even Quebeccers), fell in love with Montreal and Quebec city (i tell my friends on a budget to consider honeymooning there), and i have as much respect for France as i do for almost any other European country. Am i missing something?
(and YB - i realize you’re joking)
but i really am worried that i said something terrible in a drunken state and its coming back to haunt me.

As a matter of Fact, without work by mathematician like Legendre and Lagrande (Mécanique analytique (1788)), i doubt you could put a man in the moon. Don’t forget Mathematic is just a tool, a tool engineer and phycisian always use. Also i just said America was not a people really good in Mathematic, i never said they were bad eveywhere. I never said French were good in all social & natural science.

And yes; America is very religious.

“We are not better than France.
France is not better than us.”

How very John Wooden of you :wink:

“France has a history 10x Longer than North America.”

I don’t know, did you count the various Native American tribes spread out across North and South America?

“France is the leader of Europe.”

Wait… I always thought Germany was the ruler of Europe. Well, except for UK, which is content to be alone by themselves. (Me thinks Americans can learn a thing or two from UK)

“Can I answer my brother’s question? I hope he doesn’t get toooo mad at me.”

You have just invoked the wrath of Moses! :evil: Hmm… and I wonder who even told you that bedtime true story of the French fry?

“Paris, the City of Lights, is absolutely gorgeous and stunning beyond words.”

I don’t know, I still like Los Angeles much better. Paris… well… Paris makes me a bit queasy. But I’m sectionalist, so there’s nothing better than home sweet home. 8)

“French are all very smart, and their Enlightened Thinkers like Voltaire, Diderot, Montesquieu, and Rousseau pioneered intellectual thought.”

Hey, lets not forget the Brits either! Lets not forget such minds as John Locke came from England.

“I hope to take European Studies in high school to learn more about their history and culture.”

Rest assured, European Studies is all Western Europe all the time. (They leave much of Easterners Out! :x)

“Canadians are all around belligerent”

That’s why we need them :wink:

“resulted in bloodshed plus decades of war.”

True, I wasn’t totally down about that whole Reign of Terror/Robespierre ordeal.

“French-hater”.

So what exactly qualifies for a “French-hater?” :P

You still haven’t convinced me about the whole French-Catholic thing. You know, Atheists in America do not consider America a religious country, and they would dispute such an insinuation much as you do.

Tell me Fisternis, how many people are there in France? 100 million? How many French have you met? A couple thousand? Of those, how many do know their religious affiliation? Some of them? And you know better than some kind of census (and even if I believe that it is a projection, like Yanny said, something like 85% of people are the religion of their parents) ???

Like I said before, you should never trust just one person’s opinion on this matter. France is a big country and there are plenty of French dudes there.

@yourbuttocks:

You still haven’t convinced me about the whole French-Catholic thing. You know, Atheists in America do not consider America a religious country, and they would dispute such an insinuation much as you do.

Well, that would be irrational. They have no survey from official agencies to support their ideas anyway…

Also I never said France was irreligious, atheist are still not the major faction. But we are not 90% catholic.

Tell me Fisternis, how many people are there in France? 100 million? How many French have you met? A couple thousand? Of those, how many do know their religious affiliation? Some of them? And you know better than some kind of census (and even if I believe that it is a projection, like Yanny said, something like 85% of people are the religion of their parents) ???

~60 000 000

And what you just said is not valid from a statistic point of view, by taking only 100 person and the street and ask them what they think about religion you will have a good idea, that is probability. You just have to walk in the street, listen to our politician, look at church, listen to people to know France is not as religions as America, and there is a huge difference. If i had to say, just from what i think of France i would say…

15% Atheist
20% Agnostic
20% Reincarnationist
The rest is a mixt of Theist/Deist/people who don’t know, not a lot of people are really into religion.

…with more Atheist/Agnostic in university (like most country, certainly even in the US)

Also i can hardly imagine you really think the “85% people stick with the religion of their parent” can be applied to the French people. Bouddhism is rising quite fast, like agnosticism, people do not seem to stick a lot. You seem to forget France is full of French, and French culture is not the same as American’s culture. That is a little Americocentic to think French are subject to the same behavior as American, we had a lot of atheist thinker in the past 2 century, Voltaire, Legendre, Zola…

@yourbuttocks:

We suck at Math, Fisternis? Where did John Nash live? Where is MIT, JPL, Los Alamos, etc. located?

Ok, One mathmatician out of how many?
And did you have a look how many ppl with US-american-citizenship study math or sciences in the USA? How many professors and post-docs/staff who work in the US where born there?
….
Now comes, we may not be good, but we know how to buy the good ones…
BUT: this is not what yb said.

@yourbuttocks:

Besides, Fisternis, what French Mathematicians put a man on the moon?

Was that the german rocketbuiler? Or the american NASA dude who mixed up inches and cm and lost a multi-million Mars-probe?

:) :)

@F_alk:

@yourbuttocks:

Besides, Fisternis, what French Mathematicians put a man on the moon?

Was that the german rocketbuiler? Or the american NASA dude who mixed up inches and cm and lost a multi-million Mars-probe?

:) :)

Ja !

If the american were able to sent someone on the moon it was in a great part due to the technology they had steal from the german (they also got some german scientist)…

@FinsterniS:

@F_alk:

@yourbuttocks:

Besides, Fisternis, what French Mathematicians put a man on the moon?

Was that the german rocketbuiler? Or the american NASA dude who mixed up inches and cm and lost a multi-million Mars-probe?

:) :)

Ja !

If the american were able to sent someone on the moon it was in a great part due to the technology they had steal from the german (they also got some german scientist)…

of course it’s not a bad idea to look at a country’s ability to construct an environment favorable to the study and application of certain subjects. Certainly America has been quite successful in that regard. Even if primary and secondary schooling has been a little poor in regards to math, i think it is difficult to contend that America does not encourage persuit of advanced mathematical knowledge and applications as well or better than any other country. It’s not merely the people, but the environment.

Also the work of people 200 years ago wrt mathematics is hardly germaine to discussion on YB’s point in that if America had been as advanced as European nations at the time, certainly it might well have had its share of advanced theorems etc. upon which to build its science. That’s like saying “well, Osler’s contribution to medicine isn’t that great given that Hippocrates was Greek”.

Also German rocket-builders . . . i think as much praise should be given them as should designers of atomic (or any other) weapons of mass-destruction. Well done. Way to apply math in order to more easily kill your fellow man.

CC

“If the american were able to sent someone on the moon it was in a great part due to the technology they had steal from the german (they also got some german scientist)…”

Hey, that’s what makes America so great. We can assimilate different people from different countries all into America in the pursuit of knowledge. Often, you don’t see that in other countries, which are much more “closed doors.” If I remember correctly, the first Director of NASA was Wernher Von Braun who’s Saturn rockets put our men on the moon. Yet, he was also the same person responsible for building V2 rockets in Germany during WWII!

I just answer YB’s ironic remark, i do not want to attack americans

@FinsterniS:

I just answer YB’s ironic remark, i do not want to attack americans

you know what else is ironic? i many times find it amusing to “attack” Americans, however i think my “for” comments has outweighed my “con” comments. That’s pretty weird for the Crypt.

(note: - by “Americans” i refer to the US of A and its (lack of)culture, foreign policies, dumb people, etc. - not so much many of the individual Americans who i have met and grown to love, as well as many of my relatives)

“(note: - by “Americans” i refer to the US of A and its (lack of)culture, foreign policies, dumb people, etc. - not so much many of the individual Americans who i have met and grown to love, as well as many of my relatives)”

I am often around fellow Americans who don’t know of their own “American” culture (also responsible for the “American Dream” and the Anarchist movement). Rest assured, there is an American culture that is alive and well. Maybe it is so permeating that we forget to realize it.

For foreign policy, America has that up the wazoo. If I was in charge, less foreign policy!

Hey, lets make the would safe for dumb people! Ignorance is bliss.

First, Fisternis, I did not claim that France was Catholic. I simply said that the MAJORITY of the French are Catholic, just like the MAJORITY of Americans are Protestant, just like the MAJORITY of Israelis are Jewish and the MAJORITY of Afgans are Muslim.

Second, the fact that are early space program was dominated by Nazis from Germany, hey, thats the American way. Its why we put a man on the moon.