How are you scoring commies vs. demos?
by wars or civil wars.
So, i could add all the countries that dropped into the USSRs sphere of influence during and after WW2, and the three uprisings that were beaten down in them.
@cystic:
maybe some rich people have “earned” better rightts. Or is “to earn” an evil infinitive in Europe?
Not necessarily :)…. but it’s just so hard to tell wether someone earned or stole :), esp. when you look at the big coorporations and their bosses… they claim they earn, but obviously steal ;).
Certainly those who have inherited and stolen money are not amoung those (but in a communist society people will obtain power through similar nepotistic/criminal means too) who may be described as earning something, …
Well, in a communist society, there would be neither need nor desire to become criminal :).
however for the rest of us, i like the idea of working to earn stuff, and those who won’t work well many (not all - the disabled etc.) have made their bed, they may now lie in it.
Would be the same in a communist society. But there of course, you want to work for the better of all, a different kind of motivation than working for the better of you. You can have competition in that, but it will be fair and just competition, without trying to gain power/influence/prestige on the cost of others, but just by what you have achieved working.
In a capitalist environment i compete against other people all the time. In industry i competed against other reps, other companies. In medical school i compete for cherished residency spots in nice cities with the rest of the Canadian medical student population. Should not the best candidate for that plastics spot get it? Why should i, if i’m not willing wot work for it?
You shouldn’t, of course.
… and you don’t try to make yourself look better on the cost of others, do you?
Without copmetition all you have is an arbitrary sorting of the brain surgeons from the “monkey workers” (i.e. people who do monkey work). Which do you want working on your brain? For me, i don’t just want some doctor doing operations on my brain, I want THE BEST - the one who worked harder than everyone else, who learned more. Competition - it worked for evolution, it can work in society.
It can work for society…. unfortunately, in nature “cheating” is detected and punished. You can’t “pretend” to an advantage in the competition in nature. You can in society though, or why else do we need commercials, marketing and all that. You can cheat your way through human society, claim things for yourself you’ve never done etc… I have heard a small story, of someone giving a talk about some research he did: whenever he was involved in the work in the lab he said “i found”, “i did”, “i saw”… whenever he was not involved, he siad “we saw”, “we did”, “we found”…
that’s what i call cheating, and it is commonplace in this society!
yea well back on topic i think we should all get Hearts of Iron and play each other one day :) it would be quite interesting ^_^
We call that having a social conscience, i’m of the “advantaged”, because i am making high studies, but this does’nt justify that i will have better rights, it would be arrogant and injustified, i don’t want better treatments, better lawyer, that would be more like parasitism. I don’t consider i am an higher being or more important than a commercant or a cook, i am not working harder, and even if i am we have to consider the “whole”, not only the parts, i just had the potential to make to the university, so what, i should be considered an higher citizen, with better rights ? Don’t you have a social conscience, or you only think about yourself ? And how will you make your money, who will pay for that ?
For me, i don’t just want some doctor doing operations on my brain, I want THE BEST - the one who worked harder than everyone else, who learned more.
What’s that, if not egoism ?
Competition - it worked for evolution, it can work in society.
Sorry but this is not that simple. You found like a social Darwinist. With this rethoric you can justify war and holocaust. War is armed competition between states, and it’s the product of competition. Also i find it funny, that someone from a religion like chritianism, who does’nt believe human are animal, believe we are working like “animals”, even i, that believe we, humans, are animals, don’t believe we have to work exactly like most of them, because like Engels said, our hands and our conscience give us more choice, like ants and other beings we are marginal.
too . . . much . . . misguided . . . ridiculousness . . . .
too . . . little . . . time . . . must . . . sleep more . . . .
by wars or civil wars.
So, i could add all the countries that dropped into the USSRs sphere of influence during and after WW2, and the three uprisings that were beaten down in them.
You can judge and review wars and victories all you want but the only one that matters is the next one…
Well, in a communist society, there would be neither need nor desire to become criminal
You can help to reduce crime in a communist society but you can never fully eliminate it. :)
@TG:
Well, in a communist society, there would be neither need nor desire to become criminal
You can help to reduce crime in a communist society but you can never fully eliminate it. :)
i think i’d be working on smuggling a better life for myself.
If that’s how you want to live your life. :)
@cystic:
@TG:
You can help to reduce crime in a communist society but you can never fully eliminate it. :)
i think i’d be working on smuggling a better life for myself.
Hmmm, Fin already mentioned that:
Is that christian behavior?
btw:
I’ve got HoI….
whoooooooooowhoooooooowhoooo
it rocks ! It just rocks. Rocks rocks rocks!!!
Heh… lucky you. Some are still too poor to afford it. :(
@TG:
Heh… lucky you. Some are still too poor to afford it. :(
i bet in a communist environment everyone would have it.
Or no one would have it.
how would that work?
@F_alk:
@cystic:
@TG:
You can help to reduce crime in a communist society but you can never fully eliminate it. :)
i think i’d be working on smuggling a better life for myself.
Hmmm, Fin already mentioned that:
Is that christian behavior?
I won’t bother FS’ references to my religious beliefs in the context of my economic beliefs. They were both pulled out of context, and i really see no conflict. I believe that Christian organizations and government organization have different areas of responsibility (for example, i believe strongly in MCC, MBMS, as well as many other Christian organizations in the city, but i also believe that gov’t is not a Christian organization).
with regards to smuggling - there is nothing in the bible that contradicts this initially falacious remark. I would not be covetting my neighbour’s anything, but rather getting myself something nice (possibly for him/her to covet). And i think if i’m a successful smuggler, then that should be rewarded - but then again, i believe that people should be rewarded for working hard, being imaginative, and people should not be rewarded for laziness.
bet in a communist environment everyone would have it.
Or no one would have it.
how would that work?
Well everyone could have it. :)
I would wager a years pay on these bets…I bet that no member of the Politburo or any other member of the Soviet govt ate bread and pickled herring every day for meals…I would bet they didnt live in ramshackle housing…I bet they drove in Mercedes Benzs and Rolls Royces…I bet they lived in luxury compared to the average Russian citizen(who,by the way,deserves so much more than they have)…Communism will die eventually…A person should be rewarded for hard work…Capitalism isnt perfect, but life is not fair and we cant “share” our way to Utopia
Let me re-phrase that…We cant “share” our way to Utopia with six billion people…Socialism may work in a group of a few thousand people,but not with thousands of millions…
I take your bet… and you lost.
They did not drive Mercedes or RR but Volgas. …
but that was only part of it. You might have noticed that the above discussion was about communism as it would in theory.
Your use of the words “Russian”, “Communism” and “Socialism” together with the notion of “should be rewarded for hard work” shows that you …well, let’s say i re-bet the money i just won on that you are an USie.
First to the crime bit… no, Russia has one of the most brutal crime organisations (and yes it also exsisted in the cold war) and the triads in China is the oldest and one of the most powerful in the world, you can’t remove the crimminal mind, humans are compeditive, someone will always prove that all are equal but some are more equal than others.
And when something is illigal, there is a market for the crimminal mind.
To the Communist rule part, i myself like democracy, i like to say what i mean (it is not allowed in any communist country to say what you mean), believe in what ever religion i want (in communism all are equal and “outsiders” are not accepted), earn and spend the money i want and live the life to the fullest.
But i guess you are against these fundamental democratic terms…
Like other utopias communism is a way of thought not of life…
Communist does not… i repeat: not! …equal stalinism.
True… i didn’t say it did.
the theory regarding communism is beautiful, but unrealistic.
So when the idea is presented, men (like Stalin, Lenin, Fidel and so on) uses the idea to create their little haven for dictatorship.
All are created equal in the eyes of god, but not in the eyes of man ;)
