G4 Sea-lion Alpha +3.9

[Guest]

I agree with you! Defending those bombers will make the move even better.

[Derek]

@ErwinRommel:

Z110 where can US land?

Norway,Denmark (if soviet build a tranny turn 3), Scotland, Eire or London

If germany is to attack the soviet tranny with 4 planes round 3 Sealion is over and Russia is free to attack a round earlier.

And if you dont take london bombers will come either way just to sink the trannies! Then they will fly back to fight Japan  :-P

Honestly i miscounted the spaces from E USA to SZ110 lol
This is a good counter then.

So basically unless the allied player does not play well there will be no sealion ?

[Guest]

I wouldn’t worry too much about defending the bombers.  Those planes are committing suicide.  I would even lose the fighters and tacs before the bombers so then I don’t have to move my carriers to z104 - going out Panama is much better.  A naval base in Panama and new planes in western US puts a strong carrier force in Hawaii the following turn.

I actually tried the Soviet subs idea once and learned that they have a rough time against the destroyer and fighters before the American airstrike.  Right after the airstrike, though would be a great time for the British subs to finish off anything left alfoat.  Iceland bomber and planes from Scotland/Eireland too.  Or, the subs can always sit there in z109 and convoy raid.

[Guest]

@Uncrustable:

So basically unless the allied player does not play well there will be no sealion ?

Correct.

[Guest]

True with the “no go” on Sea Lion, its simply impossible now. But faking a Sea Lion round one is still smart, as no matter how you turn it UK still has to commit to defence! And US and Russia will have to be very skilled players in order to help out. (most players dont know the bomber move)

[Spendo02]

@Vance:

I wouldn’t worry too much about defending the bombers.  Those planes are committing suicide.  I would even lose the fighters and tacs before the bombers so then I don’t have to move my carriers to z104 - going out Panama is much better.  A naval base in Panama and new planes in western US puts a strong carrier force in Hawaii the following turn.

I actually tried the Soviet subs idea once and learned that they have a rough time against the destroyer and fighters before the American airstrike.  Right after the airstrike, though would be a great time for the British subs to finish off anything left alfoat.  Iceland bomber and planes from Scotland/Eireland too.  Or, the subs can always sit there in z109 and convoy raid.

Here’s why I use the Russian SS:

A: Land a hit and Tip the BB.

B: Get lucky with 2 hits and German player can make the mistake of tipping the CV too (German players aren’t used to preserving their CV for Ftrs to land on).

C: With that lucky roll, Germans make mistake of not landing on London means they can only scramble up to 3 Ftr if they bought an AB in Holland.  Or even better, if they SBR that AB on London earlier, they can’t scramble from it even if they DO land on London.

D: If the German player didn’t place any DD in SZ110 from Normandy, then if they take the DD as a second casualty, the UK subs can’t be hit by German aircraft.

Basically I’m willing to hope for a single hit, and get lucky with misplays by the German Admiral unaccustomed to preserving his fleet properly.

[Guest]

Sea lion can “work” (i.e. you take London), about 2/3 of the time even if the Allies have prepared well for it and Germany throws EVERY resource into it, but then Germany loses the game because they did throw EVERY resurce into it.  Pyrrhic vitory, stupid idea.  However, if the allies botch the first round Germany can do a different kind of sea lion very successfully.  It usaully consists of around 8 transports or so; not 13.

[Guest]

@Spendo02:

Here’s why I use the Russian SS:

A: Land a hit and Tip the BB.

B: Get lucky with 2 hits and German player can make the mistake of tipping the CV too (German players aren’t used to preserving their CV for Ftrs to land on).

C: With that lucky roll, Germans make mistake of not landing on London means they can only scramble up to 3 Ftr if they bought an AB in Holland.  Or even better, if they SBR that AB on London earlier, they can’t scramble from it even if they DO land on London.

D: If the German player didn’t place any DD in SZ110 from Normandy, then if they take the DD as a second casualty, the UK subs can’t be hit by German aircraft.

Basically I’m willing to hope for a single hit, and get lucky with misplays by the German Admiral unaccustomed to preserving his fleet properly.

Yeah I can see how that would work, but those subs will be toast no matter how many hits they get.  The time I did it my 3 subs got 1 hit :-(  3 British subs might sink the remnants and actually survive to convoy raid.

[Spendo02]

Ya, I don’t really expect more than a single hit from those subs.

Well worth if though if it preserves a US Bomber that can SBR German IC’s during Moscow’s push into Berlin.

[JeffM]

@Vance:

Sea lion can “work” (i.e. you take London), about 2/3 of the time even if the Allies have prepared well for it and Germany throws EVERY resource into it, but then Germany loses the game because they did throw EVERY resurce into it.  Pyrrhic vitory, stupid idea.  However, if the allies botch the first round Germany can do a different kind of sea lion very successfully.  It usaully consists of around 8 transports or so; not 13.

Vance, good points on the Sea Lion… it looks more and more like it is only a GOOD option if the Allies screw up the opening turns.  If you see that a UK player did not go all in on defense on UK1 (or is playing dumb in some way) and Sea Lion is a good option, when do you like to launch it?  G3 w 8 transports?

[Guest]

Yeah it would still be G3 but since UK didn’t build anything for defense and they did something adventurous like attacking the Italian navy, you don’t have to bring as much.