Posts made by Eschaton

I think the game works well enough without either of these exotic additions. But, this does sound like a good idea for another scenario.

That sounds like pretty cool stuff, but I don’t want to add any new units to the game. The object of this scenario is to provide an interesting 1939 scenario for beginners/casual gamers. I don’t want to make it too technical or anything like that.

In response to your playtesting and more of our own, we have decided to release a drastically different rule set, version 3, in order to address some issues brought up. Many things have been tweaked, changed, or added, so be sure to read the whole document before playing with this new rule set:

Axis & Allies Europe: 1939

VICTORY CONDITIONS: Control two enemy capitals (capitals are comprised of Moscow, Germany, Northern Italy, United Kingdom and United States) for one turn.

There are 5 playing nations: Soviet Union, Germany, Italy, the United Kingdom (and minor allied and neutral countries), France/United States. Italy is played using Japanese pieces from one of the other game boards, and France/United States uses United States pieces.

Turn Order: Germany, Soviet Union, Italy, the United Kingdom, and France/United States.

SPECIAL RULES:

Additional IPCs on Turn 1: Germany starts with 15 IPCs to spend on its first turn.
                  Italy starts with an extra 6 IPCs to spend on its first turn.
                  UK and France start with an extra 10 IPCs to spend between the two of them.
NEW UNITS MAY ONLY BE PLACED IN THEIR PLAYER’S INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX OR ADJACENT SEA SQUARE. THIS NEGATES THE PACT OF STEEL RULE.

Soviet Union:

The Soviet Union must remain at peace until Germany or Italy initiates hostilities against the Soviet Union. Then it must declare war against both of these countries and no others.

Soviet convoy does not become active until Germany or Italy attacks the USSR.

The Soviet Union may only use half of their income, rounding up, until Italy or Germany initiates hostilities against the Soviet Union.

The Soviet Union owns the pink territories and they are considered part of Soviet Territory.

Captured Soviet factories can only produce a number of units equal to that territories’ IPC value each turn.

France/United States:

U.S. convoys become active when the USA enters the war (i.e. France falls).

Maginot Line: French infantry in Eastern France or Vichy France defend on a 3 if attacked from Germany or Northern Italy, respectively.

The two British Convoys valued at 3 IPCs are French; if France falls they become British. If they have been occupied by Axis naval units, they will still need to be reoccupied by Allied powers.

Mid-East:

The total IPC value of the yellow Mid-East territories is counted to the end of each round. This money is divided between the French and British immediately for use on their next turn (in a fashion similar to British convoys in A&A Pacific).

The Industrial Complex in Egypt may only deploy 1 unit per turn.

Vichy France:

If France falls to the Axis, French IPCs are claimed by the conquering player and any French land or air units in Vichy France, the Middle East, or North Africa immediately become German (they may not move until the following turn). Any remaining French land or air units in Allied territories become British.  French naval units are scuttled (removed from play).  The French convoys become British (if under Axis control at the time, they must be liberated first). From this point forward the French player is now the United States; nothing special happens if France is liberated.

Plunder:

If the Axis conquer any of the minor allied powers (including Netherlands-Belgium and Corsica) or neutral territories (all of which are originally under the jurisdiction of the British player), that Axis country immediately gains “plunder” from the bank equal to twice the IPC value of the territory conquered to spend on their following turn (territories with no IPC value yield a plunder of 1). This only works the first time a territory of this nature is conquered.

Pact of Steel:

Axis powers can deploy units using each other’s Industrial Complexes.

Lend-Lease:

Allied units in Red territories can be absorbed by the Soviet Union during the Soviet’s purchase phase.

Other Rules:

Strategic Bombing raids can only destroy up to the IPC value of the territory in which they are conducting the raid.

Fighters cost 10, Carriers 16.  Tanks defend on a 3.

Transports can carry any of the following combinations: 2 infantry, 1 infantry and 1 tank, 1 infantry and 1 artillery, 1 infantry, 1 artillery, or 1 tank.

Destroyers can bombard.

The United States gets an industrial complex.  No new ones can be built.

Allied units may not enter Soviet territory until the Axis initiates hostilities against the Soviets.

If France falls, all Mid-East IPCs go to the UK by default. They may not be given to the United States.

The British marker is used on the side of the IPC chart to keep track of Mid-East territories.

UNIT PLACEMENT

GERMANY: 13 IPCs
  Germany: 6 infantry, 4 tanks, 2 artillery, 4 fighters, 1 bomber, 1 Industrial            Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Austria: 2 infantry, 1 tank, 2 artillery.
  Czechoslovakia: 5 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter.
  Hungary: 3 infantry, 1 tank, 2 artillery.
  Finland: 2 infantry.
  Baltic Sea: 1 battleship, 1 destroyer.
  Danish Sea: 1 transport, 1 sub.
  Denmark Strait: 2 subs.
  Barents Sea: 2 subs.
  Mid-Atlantic: 2 subs.
  South Atlantic: 2 subs.

SOVIET UNION: 18 IPCs
  Moscow: 1 infantry, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Leningrad: 1 infantry, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Stalingrad: 1 infantry, 1 Industrial Complex.
  Archangel: 1 infantry, 1 Industrial Complex.
  Baltic States: 1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  East Poland: 1 infantry, 1 tank.
  (Bessarabia, Vyborg, Caucasus unoccupied).
  Siberia: 1 infantry.
  Turkestan: 1 infantry.
  Ukraine SSR: 1 infantry.
  Belorussia: 1 infantry.
  Russia: 1 infantry.
  Karelia: 1 infantry.
  White Sea: 1 transport, 1 sub.

ITALY: 9 IPCs
  Northern Italy: 5 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Southern Italy: 2 infantry, 1 tank.
  Libya: 2 infantry.
  Sicily: 1 fighter.
  Rumania: 2 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Bulgaria: 1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Central Mediterranean: 1 sub, 1 battleship.
  Tyrrhenian Sea: 1 destroyer, 1 transport.
  (Sardinia unoccupied).

UNITED KINGDOM: 19 IPCs
  United Kingdom:  2 infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 bomber, 1 Industrial          Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Canada:  1 tank, 1 Industrial Complex.
  Malta:  1 fighter.
  Atlantic:  1 battleship, 1 destroyer, 1 transport.
  Celtic Sea:  1 transport.
  English Channel:  1 destroyer, 1 transport.
  North Sea:  1 sub.
  Davis Straight:  1 transport.
  Straight of Gibraltar:  1 battleship.
  Eastern Mediterranean:  1 destroyer, 2 transports.
  (Gibraltar and Iceland unoccupied; 2 convoys worth 5 IPCs).
Mid-East:  (see special rules for Mid-East income).
  Egypt:  3 infantry, 1 tank, 1 Industrial Complex* (see special rules)
  Trans-Jordan:  1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  (Syria, Iran, and Palestine unoccupied)
Neutral and Minor Allies:  (do not contribute to UK income)
  Yugoslavia:  2 infantry.
  Greece:  3 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Crete:  1 infantry.
  Denmark:  1 infantry.
  Norway:  1 infantry.

FRANCE:  17 IPCs
  France:  3 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex.
  Eastern France:  1 Tank, 3 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 AA gun.
  Vichy France:  2 infantry.
  Tunisia:  1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Morocco:  1 infantry.
  Algeria: 1 infantry.
  Syria: 1 infantry.
  English Channel:  1 destroyer, 1 sub.
  Western Mediterranean:  1 destroyer, 1 transport.
(Corsica, Netherlands-Belgium are unoccupied; 2 convoys worth 3 IPCs).

Well, of course the downside to having the USSR dump men and material in other countries in this game is the SAME reason Stalin never considered for a moment during the real war - it would be taking away communist troops from the defense of the motherland to defend a non-communist state. Such an action would not only have been against the communist doctrine of  the time, but also against the common-sense idea of prioritizing your own safety over the safety of your neighbors. If Germany wants to discourage the USSR from engaging in this strategy, it need only park a sizeable army on the Russian frontier.

And let me put it to you this way - Britain felt that she needed aid badly during the Blitz and the U-boat blockade. I have little doubt that if Stalin had offered military aid in the form of weapons and/or vehicles, or even an expeditionary unit, Britain would not have declined the offer. The USA was essentially already providing the UK with the same, and simultaneously remaining at peace with Germany (despite the fact that her merchant marine was more or less openly at war with U-boats on the high seas at the time!). I can’t say as much for the USA, but I’m not willing to complicate the rules just for the sake of this small discrepancy. If the USA needs to worry about being invaded, then the histories have already gone so far from the beaten path that I’m willing to accept such a possibility.

If in gameplay this proves to be too much of a boon to the allies, I will strongly consider a xenophobia clause for Russia as well. This would not, note, stop her from going on naval maneuvers.

For one thing, what is going on in tekkyy’s game is just plain bad allied gameplay, not bad rules insofar as I can see. for one thing, there is no reason that one should not find a russian bomber in any area that the germans intend on attacking.

I will be happy to play against anyone in order to justify the board’s rules as soon as I can get my hands on the A&A Europe board. It is currently at a friend’s house and needs to be recovered before I can play a game over forums.

Other than that, all I can say is that all is conjecture at this moment, because the potential problems you all have raised were not addressed in my initial round of playtesting, and niether have any of you conducted enough of your own playtesting (IMHO) to discover whether these percieved problems are in fact a reality. If you are truly interested in making this scenario better rather than just sniping at it for spite’s sake, please play about three games as each side AT LEAST before you make any initial judgement calls.

Even if I don’t get to play against one of you online, I assure you all your concerns have led me to request another round of playtesting with my friends, especially revolving around the idea of a permanently peaceful Soviet Union.

As a final note of historical conjecture on my part, I would argue that Stalin had no serious plans whatsoever to attack Germany. His officer corps decimated, his industry still growing, and his outdated equipment and training all left him in a severely inferior position relative to the German Wermacht at the start of the war. There are reports that Stalin was actually quite confident in the cease-fire agreement held by his country with Nazi Germany. In any event, I can see Stalin going to war only as soon as he felt that the Soviet Union was truly prepared. I would guess war no earlier than 1944,  and even that would have required some very silly decisions to be made.

Before you go saying that my scenario is “a farce,” make sure you play the game a few times to get a feel for it. A lot of things may seem bad on the surface, but actually work out in practice. Please don’t judge a book by its cover, in other words.

That said, I am considering adding in a variable that somehow allows the SU to get involved in the war later on, although certainly cunning soviet troop maneuvers can get the SU into the war easily enough as it is (and so I’m not quite sure what you all are complaining about).

Just test the scenario for yourselves before you go off calling “a farce” and whatnot.

It seems that many of you are held up on the idea of keeping the game turns in line chronologically with the actual events of the war. I would like, therefore, to introduce you to a concept that doesn’t change my game at all, but has helped me accept some of the seemingly more difficult problems revolving around the progression of time. I think of it as “elastic time.” What this means is that basically, a turn might represent a variable span of time, depending on what is accomplished during it. The first turn of my game, for example, might represent nearly a whole year, while the third turn might represent possibly only a month or two. Now you may reject this concept, thinking that if the time span varies, then so would the IPC output. But as we all know, the IPC output of the game is turn-based instead of the continuous stream that it would have been in real life. Therefore, it is only an approximation to begin with, and we may allow ourselves to think of the relatively large outputs during the “short” turns as the result of a buildup of military industry, or the relatively low output during the “long” turns as the result of a somehow sluggish or exhausted economy.

Ultimately, I think of time in Axis and Allies in this way because in my view it is not so important to keep the game’s events running on a strict timeline. Yes, it is important to keep things roughly within a time constraint - I would not brook the idea of thinking of a single turn as only a day or as much as three years - but so long as I can see a progression of events within the gameplay that were either actually done at the time or feasible at the time (to the best of our knowledge), then I am happy.

You might look at it another way - simply put, that it is not so important how much time has elapsed, but whether the order of events has maintained its integrity.

@ Cobert: Remember, the UK WAS powerful. Spain might have joined because they were Fascist, Turkey might have joined because of a chip on its shoulder from WWI, Saudi Arabia might have been forced to fight for the Allies, ALTHOUGH there were strong fascist sentiments in Iraq and other middle-eastern countries at that time… so it is kind of a toss-up. Can’t say for the other stuff.

@ Flashman: You really should try playing my scenario. I think it will restore faith in a flexible 1939 scenario. I have seen Germany take down the French both quickly and never at all, so it all depends on how much each power is willing to commit to the battle for France. And no, no player has Blitzkrieg rules. Everyone is given the benefit of the doubt, supposing that they might have all fought to the best of their abilities. Yes, this will lead to some historical innaccuracy, but then again I’ve always thought that so long as it doesn’t get out of hand, that was kind of the point of playing the game - to see how things might have gone differently.

@ Gewehr: You might want to try ignoring Eastern France and going straight for Paris on the first German turn. If you spent your pregame resources well, it is possible, and then all of the Vichy French will help you out as well. Just make sure that the UK can’t reinvade and use your airforce well, and it should be concievable.

@ tekkyy: If Germany hadn’t killed France quickly IRL then I believe it would have been bad news bears for Germany there too.

And thus the benefit of NOT declaring war on the Soviet Union is demonstrated.

France can indeed be POWERFUL if the British and the French are ready to commit to its defense. This is especially true if the Germans don’t do all that they can to crush France on the first turn if it looks like the Allies are going this route. I don’t find this particularly ahistorical, as the British and French, if they had had the will, COULD have had larger and better-trained armies ready. The bocage would have become as devastating for the Germans as it was for the Americans in 1944.

Now as for the rules regarding the Russian navy. I will keep things simple in the interest of keeping the game simple. The rule shall be that Axis ships moving into a sea zone occupied by Russian vessels will be considered to be opening hostilities between Russia and the Axis. However, submarines may still pass under neutral vessels without incident so long as a neutral or Allied destroyer does not also exist in this sea zone, as per normal game rules. I have made it this way in order to avoid the problem of an event in which Axis vessels exist in the same sea square with Russian vessels at the time that the Axis makes war on Russia. Moreover, I justify this historically (if somewhat weakly) by saying that Axis ships meeting any craft equipped to defend itself in international waters would likely have been fired upon, as the US merchant marine did - the reason being that German vessels especially were given a generally free reign of targets in the Atlantic, insofar as I know.

First let me preface all of this by saying that your comments have led me to offer a modified variant of the scenario which I will present below.

@ Admiral Thrawn: On the point of whether or not Italy should join at a set date, I must maintain that I think this is a bad idea. Italy was in the war before the USA was, and I believe that it would be too hard for me to get the gameplay mechanics right if Italy just sat around until France fell. As it is, a good Italian player might not attack his or her first turn anyway, building up forces for a more powerful strike in Africa. At the end of considerations, I have decided to leave Italy as is.

And while it is true, as you pointed out, that the USA had a larger army than Yugoslavia, I don’t believe it was really mobilized for war at the time, and therefore America’s start from scratch (aside from a lack of naval forces) I find to be generally close enough to the reality of the situation. Moreoever, it just helps the scenario play better.

@ timerover51: After giving myself a good history lesson, I learned that you are right about Yugoslavia. In the new version of my scenario, however, I am still giving Yugoslavia 2 infantry to reflect the Communist resistance under Tito as best I can without adding complicated resistance rules. Greece and Poland are defended differently, as well.

As for the issue of the UK’s power, I have found through playing the game that the initial German dominance of the Atlantic is momentary and limited in its effect, especially once the USA gets in the game. In all reality, I might yet increase the size of the German navy or shift things around. For now, however, everything appears balanced to me. If you disagree, I suggest you play the scenario according to the rules given here. I think you will decide differently in the end. Realistically, I think that if there is any unbalance in this scenario, it rests in favor of the Allies. The idea of the Axis actually taking Moscow, much less Britain or the USA, seems very difficult at best, especially when considering Lend-lease and several other allied options that I have delineated earlier in this thread.

OK, now here are the tweaked rules - feel free to contrast and compare with the original on the first page:

Axis & Allies Europe: 1939

VICTORY CONDITIONS: Control two enemy capitals (capitals are comprised of Moscow, Germany, Northern Italy, United Kingdom and United States) for one turn.

There are 5 playing nations: Soviet Union, Germany, Italy, the United Kingdom (and minor allied and neutral countries), France/United States. Italy is played using Japanese pieces from one of the other game boards, and France/United States uses United States pieces.

Turn Order: Germany, Soviet Union, Italy, the United Kingdom, and France/United States.

SPECIAL RULES:

Additional IPCs on Turn 1: Germany starts with 12 IPCs to spend on its first turn.
                  Italy starts with an extra 6 IPCs to spend on its first turn.
                  UK and France start with an extra 10 IPCs to spend between the two of them.
NEW UNITS MAY ONLY BE PLACED IN THEIR PLAYER’S INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX OR ADJACENT SEA SQUARE. THIS NEGATES THE PACT OF STEEL RULE.

Soviet Union:

The Soviet Union must remain at peace until Germany or Italy initiates hostilities against the Soviet Union. Then it must declare war against both of these countries and no others.

Soviet convoy does not become active until Germany or Italy attacks the USSR.

The Soviet Union may only use half of their income, rounding up, until Italy or Germany initiates hostilities against the Soviet Union.

The Soviet Union may invade any of the pink territories not owned by the Axis and gain plunder from them as Germany would. Note: once one side has gained plunder from a territory, no other country may gain plunder from that same territory.

France/United States:

U.S. convoys become active when the USA enters the war (i.e. France falls).

Maginot Line: French infantry in Eastern France or Vichy France defend on a 3 if attacked from Germany or Northern Italy, respectively.

The two British Convoys valued at 3 IPCs are French; if France falls they become British. If they have been occupied by Axis naval units, they will still need to be reoccupied by Allied powers.

Mid-East:

The total IPC value of the yellow Mid-East territories is counted to the end of each round. This money is divided between the French and British immediately for use on their next turn (in a fashion similar to British convoys in A&A Pacific).

The Industrial Complex in Egypt may only deploy 1 British unit per turn.

Vichy France:

If France falls to the Axis, French IPCs are claimed by the conquering player and any French land or air units in Vichy France or North Africa immediately become German (they may not move until the following turn). Any remaining French land or air units in Allied territories become British.  French naval units are scuttled (removed from play).  The French convoys become British (if under Axis control at the time, they must be liberated first). From this point forward the French player is now the United States; nothing special happens if France is liberated.

Plunder:

If the Axis conquer any of the minor allied powers or neutral British-occupied territories (all of which are originally under the jurisdiction of the British player), that Axis country immediately gains “plunder” from the bank equal to twice the IPC value of the territory conquered to spend on their following turn (territories with no IPC value yield a plunder of 1). This only works the first time a territory of this nature is conquered.

Pact of Steel:

Axis powers can deploy units using each other’s Industrial Complexes.

Lend-Lease:

Allied units in Red territories can be absorbed by the Soviet Union during the Soviet’s purchase phase.

Other Rules:

Strategic Bombing raids can only destroy up to the IPC value of the territory in which they are conducting the raid.

Fighters cost 10, Carriers 16.  Tanks defend on a 3.

Destroyers can bombard.

The United States gets an industrial complex.  No new ones can be built.

Allied units may not enter Soviet territory until the Axis initiates hostilities against the Soviets.

If France falls, all Mid-East IPCs go to the UK by default. They may not be given to the United States.

The British marker is used on the side of the IPC chart to keep track of Mid-East territories.

UNIT PLACEMENT

GERMANY: 13 IPCs
  Germany: 8 infantry, 4 tanks, 2 artillery, 2 fighters, 1 bomber, 1 Industrial            Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Austria: 2 infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery.
  Czechoslovakia: 5 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter.
  Hungary: 3 infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery, 1 fighter.
  Finland: 2 infantry.
  Baltic Sea: 1 battleship, 1 destroyer.
  Danish Sea: 1 transport, 1 sub.
  Denmark Strait: 2 subs.
  Barents Sea: 2 subs.
  Mid-Atlantic: 2 subs.
  South Atlantic: 2 subs.
  Iraq: 1 infantry.

SOVIET UNION: 18 IPCs
  Moscow: 1 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Leningrad: 1 infantry, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Stalingrad: 1 infantry, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Archangel: 1 infantry, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Siberia: 1 infantry, 1 tank.
  Turkestan: 1 infantry.
  Caucasus: 1 infantry.
  Ukraine SSR: 1 infantry.
  Belorussia: 1 infantry.
  Russia: 1 infantry.
  Karelia: 1 infantry.
  White Sea: 1 transport, 1 sub.

ITALY: 9 IPCs
  Northern Italy: 5 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Southern Italy: 2 infantry, 1 tank.
  Libya: 2 infantry.
  Sicily: 1 fighter.
  Rumania: 2 infantry.
  Bulgaria: 1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Central Mediterranean: 1 sub, 1 battleship.
  Tyrrhenian Sea: 1 destroyer, 1 transport.
  (Sardinia unoccupied).

UNITED KINGDOM: 19 IPCs
  United Kingdom:  2 infantry, 1 tank, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 bomber, 1 Industrial          Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Canada:  1 tank, 1 Industrial Complex.
  Malta:  1 fighter.
  Atlantic:  1 battleship, 1 destroyer, 1 transport.
  Celtic Sea:  1 transport.
  English Channel:  1 destroyer.
  North Sea:  1 sub.
  Davis Straight:  1 transport.
  Straight of Gibraltar:  1 battleship.
  Eastern Mediterranean:  1 destroyer, 2 transports.
  (Gibraltar and Iceland unoccupied; 2 convoys worth 5 IPCs).
Mid-East:  (see special rules for Mid-East income).
  Egypt:  3 infantry, 1 tank, 1 Industrial Complex* (see special rules)
  Trans-Jordan:  1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  (Syria, Iran, and Palestine unoccupied)
Neutral and Minor Allies:  (do not contribute to UK income)
  Poland:  4 infantry, 1 artillery.
  East Poland:  1 infantry.
  Yugoslavia:  2 infantry.
  Greece:  3 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Crete:  1 infantry.
  Denmark:  1 infantry.
  Norway:  1 infantry.
  (Baltic States, Vyborg, and Bessarabia unoccupied).

FRANCE:  17 IPCs
  France:  3 infantry, 1 artillery, 1 fighter, 1 Industrial Complex, 1 AA gun.
  Eastern France:  1 Tank, 3 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Vichy France:  2 infantry.
  Tunisia:  1 infantry, 1 artillery.
  Morocco:  1 infantry.
  Bay of Biscay:  1 transport, 1 sub.
  Western Mediterranean:  1 destroyer, 1 transport.
(Corsica, Netherlands-Belgium, and Algeria are unoccupied; 2 convoys worth 3 IPCs).

@ Admiral Thrawn: Those are some good ideas, but most of them won’t work for various reasons.

#1 - this seems good until you realize that the BB, with its powerful bombard, would make Italian invasions along the N African coast too easy. Moreover, Italian mini subs (and other Axis submersible weapons) were responsible for a great deal of damage to Allied shipping and even managed to cripple portions of the British fleet during the early parts of the war. Therefore subs it is.

#2 - Netherlands-Belgium used to have Armies in previous versions but aside from the fact that historically they were small potatoes and did almost nothing to halt the Axis steamroller during playtesting it was decided that any Allied presence in the Netherlands-Belgium would ahistorically halt the German advance into Western Europe, forcing the Axis to wait a turn longer for the fall of France than they could really afford to.

#3 - Although the Germans may not have had much difficulty occupying Yugoslavia, the Italians did. Moreover, Yugoslavia was a hotbed of Communist resistance during the war, and so the strong Allied presence in this territory is meant to reflect all that.

#4 - The British are quite strong in this game and need no such help.

#5 - What, really, is wrong with having the USA start off when France falls? For all we know, had Hitler not actually controlled most of continental Europe when the Japanese attacked, the USA might have concentrated first on the PTO instead of the ETO, as the ETO wouldn’t have looked all that grim.

#6 - This is an uneccesary rule and does not reflect the early actions of Italy in the war.

#7 - This rule may yet be implemented if the USSR proves to be too powerful yet. Otherwise it would be best to avoid using this rule in order to keep the rules simple and prevent an ahistorical single infantry meatshield across the entire Soviet border. Granted this can still happen without the rule, but this rule would only aggravate the situation.

@Gewehr: Although it is true that it is ahistorical to allow Axis to occupy pink territories, it is allowed in this game in order to both simplify the rules and provide for yet another potential historical deviation - what if Hitler’s armies, more confident of their blitzkrieg tactics, rolled all the way to the Soviet border, not allowing Stalin to make good on his side of the treaty? Certainly it is possible that Stalin, both amazed at the ability of the Nazi war machine and anxious to avoid war before his own military was properly mobilized, might have backed down and allowed Hitler to take all that he had conquered? After all, this was the precedent set by other national leaders - to back down and hope that this was the last demand of Hitler.

@ cyan: We could have done something like that, but we felt that things are already tough enough for the German player without the chance that it might end up fighting every single Ally at once. Besides, I don’t know if you know this, but German subs were actually fighting and sinking American Merchant Marine carrying supplies for Britain and Russian far before the USA got into the war. Roosevelt was doing practically everything possible to aid his European friends except actually declaring war on Hitler, because that would have been shot down by Congress and the American public in general. America needed something really bad and personal, something like December 7, 1941, to actually spur them to action.

As it is, if there are any balance issues with the Scenario as it is I am afraid they may lie with the Allies being to powerful rather than too weak.

I hope I get some other people to play these rules. Any suggestions on where to put them up so that a large number of A&A fans will know where to find them?

And yeah, the Stuka isn’t exactly the pinnacle of German aircraft development, but you must understand that early on in the war, the Stuka was feared for its powerful ground support capabilities, and thus is generally more memorable to us, its victims, than say the rather generic-looking BF-109. Really, it’s mostly about the recognition factor - will players of Axis and Allies generally recognize this piece as distinctively German?

Also, if you ask me, the Stuka and the Russian Sturmovik are the two aircraft they got right. Yes, the P-38 and the Spitfire were crucial to the Americans and British, but neither of them served in a ground-support role primarily, especially the Spitfire. A better choice might have been the Mosquito or the Hawker Hurricane.

How do you like the game, then?

Good god, how did you let Russia get so big? They ARE using only half of their income, right?

Corsica and Sardinia are to be considered one island, do you think I need to specify that?

@ tekkyy: When the USSR is not at war, several options are available to it, some of them rather tricky. The first is of course to start building up what forces it can with half its IPCs, readying itself against the day when the Germans will come. Another option would be to hoard all collected IPCs during peace for a sudden outpouring when the Germans finally to decide to make their move. Another would be to begin building naval vessels and using them to block Axis movement throughout the naval theater of operations. Yet another idea, perhaps the most crafty of them all, would be to begin moving Russian infantry into Allied territories, thus forcing the Axis to begin hostilities against the USSR if they want to take a given Allied territory that has Russian troops in it.

@ Gewehr: the Axis are allowed to invade the pink states and gain plunder from them without starting a war with Russia. I know this is historically innaccurate, but I like to think that had the Germans been more sure of themselves at the start of hostilities, they could have blitzed all the way to the Russian border or nearly so before the Russians got there. And if the German player doesn’t occupy these territories on the first turn, the Russians are more than welcome to them.

In your game, how are the French doing? If they have fallen (which I presume they have, since you say the US is in the war), do remember the Vichy France Rule. It can be critically important to the balance of the game. Also, how did you manage to take Iceland? I forget if that is a British territory or what. If not, remember to gain plunder from your conquest  :evil:

@ Gewehr: Actually, the USA does wait in these rules until France falls.

@ Imperious Leader: As noted in the preliminary text I supplied in the first post, My friends and I have indeed play-tested this scenario. I would not say that we have play-tested it to the point where I cannot possibly see any room for improvement, but we have reached the stage where all glaring balance issues have been sorted out.

In the interest of brevity, I will not here type a typical game in its entirety. Instead, I will list some features of gameplay that my friends and I have noticed while playing this scenario:

1. Very risky early actions with few units.
2. France’s defensive policy has a HUGE impact on the outcome of the game sometimes.
3. Germany’s offensive options allow for interesting alternate histories (e.g. never declaring war on the Soviet Union).
4. The Pact of Steel allows the Axis to engage the enemy with their naval vessels much more effectively than in most AAE games.
5. Aircraft Carriers have a somewhat limited utility in this scenario (my opinion, of course).
6. Late-game looks a lot more like normal AA, with large battles between tank forces on land and the like.
7. Italy is very small, but fun to play as.
8. Division of the Axis powers makes for a more diverse enemy.
9. Axis countries rely to a great deal on inertia - they cannot compete economically with the Allies at almost any point - but they are not weak by any means.
10. Britain is generally more powerful on this map.

As an interesting aside, Soviet violation of the  has been disabled because we found that, generally, if the USSR had declared war on Germany in 1939 the war would have been won quite shortly - both in real life and during playtesting on this scenario.

In my games usually it turns out that Japan is small potatoes compared to Germany. Germany wins the war, Japan just makes things difficult for the Allies. This has been proven by our play when Japan has been totally abandoned  by the Allies and all efforts have focused on Germany.

That said, in my experience there are some things Japan can do to make a late game Axis victory (even if Germany is KO’ed!) a possibility. The first Japanese turn, I believe they should buy one IC and a bomber. The American fleet at Pearl harbor should be crushed. If the British fleet in India is still around, it should be crushed, and if nothing has happened to reinforce India, it should be taken as soon as possible. The Russian space above Manchuria should be annihilated, as should China. All of this should happen as soon as possible. The IC should go in French Indochina and begin one of two strategies immediately - Either shoring up against an unconquered India or, if India is conquered, begin producing tanks to push into the Caucasus, Africa, and Siberia. While this is happening, the Japanese fleets (what’s left of it) should regroup off French Indochina or Japan and begin preparing for an American presence in the Pacific. The two bombers you’ll have can switch off between supporting your ground assaults and providing an extra bit of offensive power to your navy (thank god for 6 moves, they can be everywhere!). Try to maneuver the Allied navy into an attack on your navy, where your defensive fighers and carriers will pack much more firepower than their attacking equivalents. At all times, seek to deny them of the opportunity to destroy your navy completely. Harry them further by periodically invading Alaska or Canada. All the while, keep the pressure on Russia, denying them their rear area IPCs and even strategically bombing them in order to make Germany’s job easier.

In this fashion, I have played games where, when Germany fell, all of the Allies were still alive, and yet Japan came out of nowhere and conquered Russia, then crushed an Allied tank force in Eastern Europe. It was a monster, with over 70 IPCs and two monstrous navies. Granted, it still seemed like the Allies would eventually win, but it was truly an epic Japanese game all the same.