German Strategies

@Advosan:

I m not saying G should let R keep those lands. If G cannot counter from EE and reestablish the Karel-Belor-Urk line it must abandon the anti-ship build (sub+bomb) for 1 turn, beef up in Germ and retake them. I m only suggesting G shouldn t press any further towards R, not before it raises 47-49 IPC from Afrika.

47-49 IPC is a long shot for G to reach, usually it will only get there to turn 4-5. Of the initial 40, G will usually lose Norway, making it down to 37. Africa has 9 IPCs (not counting Madagascar) and the UK can withdraw its forces to S. Africa and it will take a lot of time to kill those units. Plus, any units brought to Africa aren’t available to deal with the Russians. If R moves the bulk of this units to Ukraine and G can’t destroy then G will be squeezed. Africa is important for the Axis but focus too much on it and its forces in Europe will be overwhelmed.

I know a lot of Axis players favor the strategy of a combined G-J push against Moscow, but it can never work unless the Allies screw up and let Moscow burn.

Then why do a lot of Axis players favor that combined G-J strategy? Because they like to lose?

First, thanks for sharing strategies Advosan, but second, the strategy your suggesting is only good for guarding the Atlantic for a few turns and getting Africa. It ignores the fact that letting Russia run roughshod over Europe makes them next to impossible to take down. It also delays Germany from taking Russia since they have to wait at least round two to take Egpyt, more if UK decides to guard it amd this means UK has more money for ship builds. If the Allies are patient in the Atlantic, there’s nothing Germany can do to stop them. Eventually they will outbuild Germany, and once they’re able to land, Ger won’t have enough defence to stop them. This kind of game usually ends in round 5 or 6.

I do agree with you that Germany needs African money. My advice is to go for Egypt first and only add boats when you’re up money. I also like the Med ship build on round 2 or 3. Hopefully you can afford it by then (you might be up to 44).

I’m a fan of the round 1 Baltic AC build. I know a lot of people don’t like it but you save 15 ipcs and increase the range of your planes, which will delay the Allied Atlantic ship builds for a couple rounds.

If you ever see Russia build a Sub round 1 then it would be an alright time to do your strategy (although I still wouldn’t do it).

@Hobbes:

@Advosan:

I m not saying G should let R keep those lands. If G cannot counter from EE and reestablish the Karel-Belor-Urk line it must abandon the anti-ship build (sub+bomb) for 1 turn, beef up in Germ and retake them. I m only suggesting G shouldn t press any further towards R, not before it raises 47-49 IPC from Afrika.

47-49 IPC is a long shot for G to reach, usually it will only get there to turn 4-5. Of the initial 40, G will usually lose Norway, making it down to 37. Africa has 9 IPCs (not counting Madagascar) and the UK can withdraw its forces to S. Africa and it will take a lot of time to kill those units. Plus, any units brought to Africa aren’t available to deal with the Russians. If R moves the bulk of this units to Ukraine and G can’t destroy then G will be squeezed. Africa is important for the Axis but focus too much on it and its forces in Europe will be overwhelmed.

You are correct, it takes G4-5 to reach 47 IPC (G1 fortify Algeria, G2 counter Lybia or blast AE, G3/4 blitz FWA and capture TJ and either BC or IEA, G4/5 move respectively towards Persia, attack other Afrikan lands). But still, this is the very quintessence of the Axis game. Axis has no initiative early in the game. By pushing towards Moscow you spread yourself thin.

The question that G has to answer is “how to protect the highly valued BB”. Yoy cannot allow the BB to die in UK1, the arfikan campain dies with it. The only way to keep it alive is  G1 capture Gibr, destroy UK Cr and either kill UK DD or buy a DD and block it (or choose the G1 capture of both AES and TJ, which leaves Algeria exposed and the UK Cr probably alive).

I know a lot of Axis players favor the strategy of a combined G-J push against Moscow, but it can never work unless the Allies screw up and let Moscow burn.

Then why do a lot of Axis players favor that combined G-J strategy? Because they like to lose?

No, Axis choose G-J combined push because the Allies can easily screw up. Most common screwing up is the UK not invading Europe in time, relieving the pressure off R. Allied micromanagement is quite challenging, but Axis cannot really hope to win by waiting for an Allies mistake.

Most times, the Axis strategy mistake is equalled by an even bigger Allies strat mistake, KGF. G can endure a tremendous amount of pain, giving J all the time in the world to grow to an impossible 40 IPC or even more. If J is left unchallenged by the US in the Pacific and it reaches 40, it can easily simultaneously a) invade Alaska, midway and hawaii b) start working its way to Moscow c) go for Arfica and d) go for Oceania, resulting to an inevitable blasting of the G combined pressure. If the dice go by the odds, J needs only to J3 to reach 40 IPC if left unchallenged:

• J1 china (3 Kwan+1 Manc inf), garrison FIC (with 2 Manila inf), buy 2 DD 2 tran
• J2 xingyang, Ind (+2 EasInd inf), counter Manch
• J3 Butyatia, SFA and Persia or Madagascar.

G can easily endure untill G3 everything the Allies can throw at it. And if J reaches 40, it it impossible to bring it down, it can only go even higher, J4 Aussie, maybe Africa, and Alaska or Hawaii, J5 Kiwi, even Brazil in J6 (trans from Hawaii), while pooring troops in Asia against Moscow.

It won’t matter if Japan is up money if they’re not putting pressuring on Russia and if you’re seperating your navy, then you’re making it vulnerable.

@Dylan:

To me it’s easier as the Axis. So with the Germans produce tanks in the East. In the West send many reinforcements into West Europe a lot. Make sure you build a Carrier though first turn. Then Move in closer to the British Navy with planes on the Carrier and Bomb London and land in Germany. Start matching up your units with transports once you take out the Royal Navy.

You aren’t taking into account that the Royal and US Navies can sync as early as rd3. How will you take them out? It is better to wait and see where the Allies commit in the sea. If they go Med, then quick control of the Suez is key, and Japan can move its Indies fleet to Italy sea zone, land Axis planes on the carrier, and you have a solid defense set up there (2BB, 2ftr, 1AC). One of the Allied fleets will have to trade most of itself to take it out, and rebuild for the next 2-3 rounds. Whenever I have used this strat it has paid off big. If they go Baltic (probably more common), building a carrier there is good to help delay landings, but you cannot expect to “take out” anyone. However, forcing the Allies to build more navy and delay major landings until late mid-game (rd6 or 7 i’d say) is a victory for Germany in itself. Also note that time is always on the Allies’ side, which means if the game goes longer than 8 rounds the Axis are most likely screwed, but if they are going to win from that point, it’ll be because of German infantry stacks, NOT navy.

They key to German success and indeed any success is economics.  Africa is key to German economic success and the Mediterranean fleet is key to that end, Germany knows it or should, and the allies do as well.  The allies should go all out to destroy the German fleet, the Germans to protect it long enough to allow forces to flow to africa and require a huge investment by the allies to push the German fleet away to allow landings in Africa.

My philosophy calls for economic success in africa, delay allied invasion of Norway, create asymmetrical economic threats, ie, make the bastards pay more to counter your threat than your threat cost.

The typical Russian move:

Build mostly infantry and a bit of artillery

Russia goes large into West Russian, takes out Ukraine to destory the fighter and goes into a defensive position in the east, sub in with the brit BB.

German builds, now it gets interesting.  Britain should be building bombers and subs to chase the German fleets, moving british air units to the Caucus territory quickly, the time to build german navy is now or never!

A carrier in the Mediterranean add a transport unless Russia really crushed in opening moves as you might be too thin.  The drawback in not building the transport on turn 1 is that the german surface fleet might want to stay in seazone 15 for turn 2-4 to lump forces in to an area where they can do combat and earn you territories quickly and take both sides of the canal.  You will need to combine the BB and Carrier right away.  Later you might sacrafice  1 of the transports to get units to the south of africa quickly or take Madagascar.  Sooner or later, the allies will probably force your navy to run into the red sea and your supply line to africa is lost.  By then the carrier has paid for itself several times in IPCs from africa and forced the allies to invest huge amounts of money in a navy that has no enemy to fight now.  The allies land huge in Africa and now their forces are abut 6 moves away from Russian and the navy useless.

Maybe also sub in the baltic,  make the Brit build destroyers, then make him trade a DD for a sub, your newly built sub plus air units will make short work of lone destoryers.  If the allies don’t chase the subs then they can be grouped with the Med navy to fend off allied landings requiring the allied navy to stay in seazone 12.  The drawback obviously is now Germany is short on land units and has a southern navy designed to moved 4 land units per turn into Africa.

Normally, as German I try to take out the British battleship, cruiser and destroyer, egypt and retake Ukraine (to destory the surviving russian tanks) leaving only the transport off Canada.  The naval battles seem a bit risky for Germany and expensive as you should count on losing about 2 planes using the typical all out against the brit navy tactic.  Egypt has gone wrong more often than it should which is fatal to Germany.

I have tried this exactly once, it worked and will do so tommorow night I believe!  Leave the Brit navy alone in seazone 1 and 2, Blasphemy I know!  Use the sub and 2 fighters against the cruiser.  BB against the DD, invading Egypt with 2 INF, 2 Tanks, bomber and fighter.  The two remaining fighers are used against russian forces.

You should end up with 2 tanks in egypt, the Brits should counter attack with forces from India sacraficing the transport and escaping the cruiser and carrier from the Japanese forces.  With wave 2 of the German forces the brits are a spent force in egypt, let the IPC harvest begin!

I had reinforced Norway with 2 INF and put 1 if not both other fighters in Norway as well.  I put the two german subs in sea zone 6 to attack anything that moved into sea zone 3.  However, just today I read in the AA42 FAQ and much to my horror, I read the Brits can build in sea zone 3?  That would allow the brits to invade norway and build a carrier in sea and 2 destroyers in sea zone 3 and have the US put fighters on it  Perhaps leaving Norway or even evacuating it would be the thing to do?

The next few turns would see the allies building enough navy to move into africa while defending against german subs, air and surface fleet.  The asymmetric costs and IPC differential I feel more than outweigh the initial cost of the fleet expansion and the lost opportunity of re-allocating resources elsewhere.  The German fleet once outnumbered moves into the Indian Ocean and provides cover against allied air for Japanese forays in the theatre and a threat to always move back into the mediterranean.

So, hairbrained or potentials here?

@Dylan:

To me it’s easier as the Axis. Then pretty much do what i said in the German campaign.

Hope that helps :-)

@Dylan, how do possible expect to pull all this off with Germany? Do you play with dice all numbered 1 for the axis? Your conquer-everything-with-no-problems-at-all approach could only work if you playing a 2yr old. How can 1 CV hold off all of Britain’s and US’s air/navy long enough for you to match your land forces up with defenseless transports?

I think Dylan just forgot to prefix the entire plan with “As he says with tongue firmly planted in cheek……”.  I actually do have a 6 sided dice with 2 sets of 1, 2, 3, comes in handy at times…Just wish I had 10 of them… By the way, its easy to spot, its the only yellow die I have, sticks out real good like.

I think Germany is screwed!  OK, my first 6 games of 1942 we used the optional rule to close off the Black Sea as it really was during WWII apparently.  No russian sub builds for the Mediterranean.  I’m not sure how many of you folks use the optional rule and our group figured we best learn to play without the rule.

In a previous post I outlined how Germany with that optional rule in place builds a mediterranean carrier + another transport and on G1 used the battleship to knock out the brit destroyer, 2 fighters for the cruiser, sub for lone transport and fighter and bomber for the brit battleship.  2 lost german fighters on G1 is typical after losing 1 on R1 leaving only 3.  The baltic subs move up and its a bit scarey for Britain to build navy just yet.

So now without using that optional rule, I as the allies build 2 russian subs on R1 and ensure both fighters can hit the German navy.  Germany doesn’t want to split their navy so doesn’t attack Egypt.  Now on G1 the 2 fighters not previously used against the brit navy are used against the destroyer in the mediterranean and then land on the carrier.  With the 2 russian subs a german destroyer is required at some point and won’t be able to be built on G2 as the navy probably moves to SZ 15 leaving a newly built destroyer to face 2 russian subs and perhaps a plane or two.  If you are brave perhaps even a sub, a heck of an investment in german navy but economically it seems to pay for itself in africa, but at what cost of momentum against the russians?

Even with my buddy getting a bit lucky as Germany, taking out the entire british navy in the mediterranean and atlantic losing only 1 plane the axis still seems doomed.

As the Allies I go KGF hard with the exception of the British Indian fleet which hangs around S. Africa to keep the Japs honest in that area.

R1 builds are 2 subs 4 INF, 2 attacks Ukraine and west russia, slowly pull back from Japanese forces but don’t run.

Britain can’t defend a newly built navy against 3 subs and 3 fighters and a bomber that can hit in all sea zones except 2 and 3.  I like to take out the Baltic transport and destroyer in the first round as the brit air assests on england can’t attack anything else, there is always that 1/3 chance of losing a plane.  If you build a sub and wait until the second turn Germany just attacks the sub with the destoryer as he loses it anyways, might as well take out the sub and maybe a plange to kill it next turn!  Building in 2 and 3 means you cannot link the US and Brit navies in one move so I build NOTHING save maybe 1 sub.  Britain moves the Indian ocean fleet to sea zone 33 taking the infantry from Persian and TransJorden to Rhodesia,  The sub from SZ 40 goes to 30, the transport from 40 to 42 to entice the Jap to use the sub there rather than against Pearl Harbour.  Evacuate Egypt as Germany has 10 land units that can hit it,  Pull south to ensure 2 german tanks won’t blitz, make Germany move south 1 territory per turn to buy time.

USA builds 2 Carriers, 1 sub, 1 destroyer in the atlantic.  Pearl harbour has left the Pacific with 1 BB and it can be threatened by the jap fighters from the carrier, a BB and transport against 2 fighters is an economic win by Japan by 5 IPC on average so I pair the BB with the destoyer in zone 20, hence the build of a destroyer.  I’d leave the Pacific sub to harasses and keep the Japs honest with transports, make 'em buy at least 1 DD.

Round 2:
Russia: 
Builds are all Infantry, maybe 1 art.  The russian subs have to move to SZ 34 to get out of danger from the german fleet.  The rest are moves of opportunity.

Germany:
Builds:  All infantry save for maybe 1 Art.  Germany moves more forces to africa taking Egypt and probably Transjorden by moving the fleet and does what it can in Europe and for now there is NO allied threat to west europe.  All 4 subs to SZ 13

Britain: 
Instant navy time.  Even with 2 US carriers and the entire US fleet including the BB, the allied navy is barely strong enough to move to SZ 12 on turn 3 which is the first goal….Africa.  Germany will keep her fleet in SZ 14.  That means germany can attack SZ 12 with 4 subs, 1 DD, 1 BB, 1 CV, 1 Bomber and 3 fighters assuming no more navy or airforce is built on G2 and typical losses against 2 CVs, 4 Ftr, 1 Cruiser, 1 BB, 2 DD and 1 sub.  A slight allied advantage according the simulator.  Add just 1 more german sub or an extra fighter now its an axis advantage.  Add in the fact half a dozen transports sink and the allies are set back 2 turns and Germany HAS to attack.  Britain needs a few combat ships and already has 2 fighters, a CV seems natural.  The US could build just 1 CV as it only has 3 fighters at this point, but even with 1 fighter, 14 IPC gets you 2 units, the fighter you already own plus the CV, defense of 6, better than 2 destroyers…So, builds…1 CV, 1 DD, 1 Sub (always nice to pair with a DD when hunting other subs), 3 transports, 1 tank and 2 INF.  Navy builds in SZ 8
Moves: Since Japan probably did pearl harbour the navy in 33 and sub 30 all move to 34 with the russian subs, two strong for the German navy to attack since only 2 planes should be able to hit and with 3 subs, a cruiser and fully loaded carrier, me thinks neither germany nor Japan can attack at this point.  If Germany can attack, you better make sure you take one side of the suez canal or else don’t move up!

Japan even while left alone really can’t do too much too quickly yet, The British Indian ocean navy keeps them honest in that area for now.

The US of A
Builds, 1 transport the rest mostly infantry, a few tanks and artillary.  Hold off building the 5th transport, each transport you build requires 2 loads of equipment that turn as well, one to go and one to move towards E. Canada for pick up from the fleet in SZ 12.  Also, I like to flow some units from W. USA to W. Canada then to E. Canada just so the Japs don’t pull a prick shot and land in alaska.  Always build tanks in W. USA unless you also build a transport to move it, that way it moves to E. Canada in 1 turn or counter attacks in Alaska, with a few infantry steadily marching up the west coast, Japan with think twice about playing games!

The US now moves its navy from SZ 10 to 8 SZ 20 to 8.  Now you set up the shuck from E. Canada to Algeria.

Turn 3

Russia, nothing unique, targets of opportunity, slowly pull away from unfavourable combat with the Japs, pressure Germany.  Builds, mostly infantry, always 1 art maybe 2-3, maybe a tank.  Russia always needs a few tanks.

Germany…
Builds have to be infantry.  With the allied navy now a threat against europe it has to be defended.  The only hope in Africa is to lump as much as you can into Libya to counter strike the allied landing in Algeria or try to defend Algeria from landings in the first place, tough to do if you want income around egypt…  Even if you are too strong in Algeria for them to land, the allies just land a smaller force into French West Africa.  Smaller as the US navy from SZ 8 won’t reach, but could go to 18 to be ready to assault into south Africa the next turn or Shuck to England.

England: 
Builds mostly infantry then more tanks to catch up to the waves of infantry moving across africa.
Shuck into Africa then into Norway as opportunities present (ie, german navy and airpower not able to threaten a split navy).  England should concentrate on Norway as its a single move shuck where for the US its not.

The US:
Builds all land forces 6 INF and 4 tanks is the 38 or so IPCs the US will on average get.  5 Transports is all you need for shucking to Algeria.  A few extras are nice to move a few units to Norway, having just a few US units up that ways helps for especially when combined with some airpower, what the US fails to get the USSR usually can finish up and collect the IPCs.

So at this point the allies are on auto-pilot.  They retake africa, don’t need to attack the german navy as once the german army is destroyed or pushed out of Africa and allied forces flow across north africa there is nothing 2 transports and 4 land units can do to affect africa, at best, the german navy defends against prick shot landings in S. Europe at worst it ties up 2 german fighters on defense.  The economic advantage is with the allies and they also seem to be dictating the terms of engagement.  Japan while strong can’t grow much past 45 IPC/turn and is always just 1-2 turns away from putting away the USSR then once the allied forces move across Africa and into south asia its pretty much over, the writing on the wall for the Axis.

So, should Germany just forget about africa and not build a navy? The invesment in German navy does force the allies to build more navy then they would have to otherwise.  The income from Africa does seem to repay the investment in navy and forces moved to Africa.  But at what lost opportunities?

I have a strategy: G1:Take out the British  Navy (uk homeland only) with as many fighters as you can that were not purchased. Try to regain lost territory. Evacuate all units except for 1 unit in each tt the middle of your empire .Buy naval (except submarines){preferably cruisers}. G2: Take out the British Med. navy with as many fighters as you can purchased or not purchased. Buy infantry to defend Africa if your naval battles went in your favor. If the naval battles were in UK’s favor, buy all navy again like i instructed with turn 1. Try to regain at the maximum 2 lost tt’s if you lost any tt’s. G3: Invade London. Buy all fighters. Move all fighters not in victory cities to London.G4: Invade Russia, first with Karelia, then Caucases and buy all tanks and stockpile them where and if you succeeded. If you failed, put the tanks in your nearest territory to Karelia or Caucauses. G5: Take Archangel, if you suceed, take Moscow. If not, invade Moscow with all of your tanks within reach. Buy all tanks. G6: You suceed. Now help out Japan. Don’t focus on the US at all.

@nutbar:

Don’t focus on the US at all.

But what if the US focuses on you?  yeah there not a threat till a bit later but when they come you can’t ignore them