Instead of trying to keep at all cost the same OOB balance of Carrier combat value ratio amongst other units, my starting point was the 6 IPCs Fighter (an already introduced unit in the A&A family via 1914).
This time, my intent is to bring the same cost to a 1942/G40 Fighter unit with similar combat value to 1914 Fighter.
This basic 1914 Fighter Attack 2 Defend 2 Cost 6, which have an unlimited number of dogfight combat rounds against other planes, is in fact very similar to what I suggested as House Ruled Fighter able to hit directly other enemy’s plane within regular combat phase instead of inside a special dogfight phase.
Besides range, both Fighters have the same capabilities, except that 1914 Fighter rolled dices apart then, any winner of the Air Supremacy can get a roll against ground units.
My houseruled Fighter is simply rolling alongside other units, since it is not necessary to have a special phase, only to roll Fighter dices separately, nothing more, nothing less, to identify enemy’s plane casualty.
This is combined with a 3-planes Fleet Carrier able to carry any combinations of Fighters and Tactical Bombers (3 Fgs or 3 TcBs or 2 Fgs & 1 TcB or 1 Fg & 2 TcBs).
So such Fighter unit will be at an even cost with Tank unit A3 D3 M2 Cost 6 IPCs.
It is more able to figure the usefulness of both Tank and Fighter (2 mains driving machine-weapons of WWII) on the battleground, not just Tank, and make them equivalent loss, from IPCs POV.
Tanks (A3 D3 M2 C6) get a better offensive and defensive punch and can be shielded by AAA, Infantry, Mechanized Infantry and Artillery units as fodder.
Fighters (A2 D2 M4 C6) are more versatile but have a lower offensive and defensive punch than Tank, and are unable to conquer land territory by themselves while being directly vulnerable to AAA unit and other Fighter.
In this perspective, it becomes clearly necessary to have Submarine unit a bit cheaper than 6 IPCs, otherwise Fighters will becomes far more interesting for the same cost because of his versatility in both Naval and Ground combat.
For example, if both units at 6 IPCs, a German player will always buy Fighters rather than Submarines, since it will be able to use them as fodder in Naval with Carriers and get them in the ground when necessary.
The idea is also to provide expensive units (warships and planes) at a lower cost, so it will be easier to renewed the stock of lost planes, due to higher attrition.
So, a working graduated roster need to use the Advanced Shipyard cost with a few changes.
This will have the advantage of getting on the roster a substantial unit at 5 IPCs: Submarine (as Black_Elk noted elsewhere).
@Black_Elk:
I have long felt that ships should be cheaper, especially to bring them in line with the relatively cheap cost of air in G40.
I’d fully support this cost structure for ships, provided the Sub only cost 5 ipcs as well.
The game needs a decent unit at a cost of 5 ipcs anyway, since anti air artillery doesn’t do the trick here. If subs only cost 5 (like the old tanks did), it would be easier to support a decent convoy campaign, for Germany to conduct a more effective battle of the Atlantic for example, or just generally for Allies to support the large surface fleets they need to build to get into the fight.
The structure suggested above with the inclusion of subs at 5 ipcs, would be superior to OOB, in support a robust naval game. I’d go for it.
And I gained a progressive cost for the three type of planes: Fighter at 6 IPCs, Tactical Bomber at 8 IPCs and Strategic Bomber at 10 IPCs.
In addition, with more money and low cost of Fighter, the Anti-Aircraft Artillery unit can now works almost like other regular ground units, in the subsequent combat rounds, without being overpowered.
This idea was inspired by Oztea:
@oztea:
No new air units. But the current ones should be cheaper, and have slightly different rules.
Fighters 8, bombers 10
Fighters hits of “1” and the person rolling gets to assign that hit to an air unit if present.
AA guns should continue to fire every round. 3 shots the first round, 1 shot every round after.
Here is all the main A&A units roster with a summary of their special abilities (which some are house rules I already used):
ANTI-AIRCRAFT ARTILLERY A0 D0 NCM1 Cost 3, 1 hit,
Up to 3 preemptive defense @1 against up to 3 planes,(as OOB AAA) but
also able to fire regular defense @1 against up to 1 plane on the following combat rounds.
Infantry A1-2 D2 M1 Cost 3
Get +1A if paired 1:1 with Artillery
Mechanized Infantry A1-2 D2 M2 Cost 4,
Get +1 if paired 1:1 with Artillery
Can Blitz when paired 1:1 with a Tank
Artillery A2 D2 M1 Cost 4
Gives +1A to 1 Infantry or 1 Mechanized Infantry
SUBMARINES A2 D1 M2 Cost 5
Surprise Strike,
Submerge (instead of rolling to hit a target)
No hostile sea-zone (except when Anti-Sub Vessel is present),
Cannot hit airplanes,
Must be taken as the last casualty amongst warships, (said otherwise, Submarines can only be picked as casualty when their is no more surface warships illegible.)
Allowed to retreat separately from other units, (said otherwise, other units can retreat while the submarines stay in combat zone to finish off the enemy’s ships.)
Can hit transport before warships (even when there is other escorting warships, but it is the owner’s choice to pick or not a transport as casualty).
(Added to recreate opportunity for an Atlantic Battle in 1942.2 and also to reduce the effectiveness of Submarine on offense against Destroyer and costlier warships.)
Can be hit by planes, doesn’t require an Anti-Sub Vessel.
Simplifying units interactions of Transports, Submarines, Destroyers & planes
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34290.msg1320853#msg1320853
TANK A3 D3 M2 Cost 6
Can Blitz or allow Mechanized Infantry to blitz on a 1:1 basis.
FIGHTER
Attack 2, same in SBR
Defense 2 or 3, same in SBR
Move 4
Cost 6
1 hit
Air combat unit, Fighter as an Air Superiority aircraft:
All hits are allocated to aircraft units first, if any available.
Combined Arms Bonus:
Gives +1 Attack to any Tactical Bomber paired 1:1 with.
Fighter as part of an extended Air Defense System:
Up to 3 Fighter units receive +1 Defense if protecting a territory with an operational Air Base, (or 1 Fg for a Victory City if playing 1942.2)
SBR/TcBR Attack @2, Defend @2, or even defend @3 for up to 3 Fgs if an operational Air Base is present.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
DESTROYER A2 D2 M2 Cost 7
Anti-Sub Vessel on 1 DD:1 Sub basis, block surprise strike but cannot cancel Sub submerge (which mostly happen for defending Subs in regular phase after the attacker rolls).
TRANSPORT A0 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit, taken as last casualty,
Exception: can be picked as a casualty anytime when an enemy’s submarine hit has to be allocated (owner’s choice to pick or not transport as casualty, as usual).
Simplifying units interactions of Transports, Submarines, Destroyers & planes
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34290.msg1320853#msg1320853
@Baron:
Another way to increase a better defense is a compromise for taken last transport A0 D1.
Only Subs hit can be allocated to transport before warships.
This can somehow re-enact Subwarfare against Transport and Destroyers reaction to attacking Subs.
TACTICAL BOMBER
Attack 2 or 3 or 4, SBR @1
Defense 3
Move 4
Cost 8
1 hit
Combined Arms bonus, Tactical Bomber as a less vulnerable “Dive” or “Torpedo” Bomber when escorted by Fighter:
**_Gain +1 Attack, when paired 1:1 with a Fighter .
Air Supremacy Bonus, Tactical Bomber as a “Dive Bomber”:
Gain +1 Attack when no enemy’s aircraft is present.
These two bonuses can be added to raise up to Attack @4.
Combined Arms Bonus with Tank, Tactical Bomber as a “Tank Buster”:
Get +1 Attack when paired 1:1 to any Tank. (Similar to G40 OOB bonus)
Air Supremacy bonus can be added to this bonus.
In this case, a lone Tactical Bomber reach Attack @4 as long as it is paired to a Tank and have Air Supremacy.
SBR/TcBR attack @1,
Allowed to do escort mission of Strategic Bomber without doing Tactical Bombing Raid on Air Base or Naval Base,
Cannot do interception mission on defense,
TcBR damage: 1D6.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
(G40 Escort Carrier) A0 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit
Carry 1 Fighter or 1 Tactical Bomber,
Anti-Sub Vessel, working the same as a Destroyer, added for completeness
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
(1942 Escort Carrier) A1 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit
Carry 1 Fighter or 1 Tactical Bomber,
Anti-Sub Vessel, working the same as a Destroyer, added for completeness
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
Cruiser A3 D3 M2 Cost 9
Shore bombardment @3
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Carrier: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
STRATEGIC BOMBER (Medium Bomber)
Attack 4, SBR @1
Defense 1
Move 6
1 hit
Cost 10
Strategical Bombing Raid (SBR*)/ TBR : Attack @1
SBR/TBR damage: 1D6+2 on Industrial Complex, Air Base or Naval Base
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
(High Altitude Strategic Bomber) (Heavy Bomber)
Re: Rethinking Air Units
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34502.msg1331015#msg1331015
Attack 4, SBR @1
Defense 1
Move 7
1 hit
Cost 12
Strategical Bombing Raid (SBR*)/ TBR : Attack @1
SBR/TBR damage: 2D6 on Industrial Complex, Air Base or Naval Base
If destroyed by IC’s, AB’s or NB’s AA gun, reduced SBR damage: 1D6-1
No damage if destroyed by Fighter interceptor.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
1942.2 FLEET CARRIER A1 D2 M2 Cost 12, 1 hit
Carry 3 planes (Fg or TcB)
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
G40 FLEET CARRIER A0 D2 M2 Cost 14, 2 hits
Carry 3 planes (Fg or TcB)
Damaged Carrier can still carry 1 plane.
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
BATTLESHIP A4 D4 M2 Cost 16, 2 hits
Shore bombardment @4
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Cruiser and 1 Carrier: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
If you want to increase battle between planes, at least allows 1 single Fighter or Tactical Bomber to land in a just conquered territory, as long as it have another extra movement point for landing.
SBR/TBR escort and intercept combat values:
Fighter: Attack 2 Defense 2 or 3
Tactical Bomber: Attack 1 Defense 0
Strategic Bomber: Attack 1 Defense 0
For my part, I would allow 3 types of defensive maneuvers for aircraft.
DEFENSIVE MANEUVERS allowed for 2 or 3 types of aircraft:
Aerial Retreat for attacking planes (all aircrafts can retreat while letting ground units pursuing battle),
Limited Aerial Withdrawal of 1 space in a friendly territory is allowed any round after the first combat round for defending planes up to 2 StBs or 2 TcBs or 2 Fgs.
Limited landing in a just conquered territory: 2 planes (either Fighter or Tactical Bomber), as long as each units can provide 1 extra movement point for this special landing.
What do you think about all this?
Consistent cost?
Playable? Funny? Still somewhat able to depict historical situations?
The additional IPCs available due to reduced cost will really do what it is intend for?
A last ground unit to complete my roster and get a whole picture of the main weapons of WWII:
@Baron:
Here is a much more A&A paradigm rules version for a single type of Mobile Artillery unit (SPA / SPG /TD) that I revised from my previous post:
MECHANIZED ARTILLERY (Assault Gun)
Attack: 2
Defense: 2
Move: 2
Cost: 5
Can blitz when at least a Tank is present in a group of units.
It means that any number of MechArt can blitz when a Tank is blitzing. In addition, this Tank can be already paired to a MechInf while blitzing.
Infantry Support: Give +1A to a paired Infantry or Mechanized Infantry.
Tank Hunter as a Tank Support ability: Get +1A/D when paired to a Tank.This unit on attack cannot give and get both bonus as Inf support & Tank support when teamed up with both MI and Tk.
You must choose which bonus is use, and can change during the battle round, switching from one to the other according to which unit the MechArt is paired to.I think it could be better balance and nearer A&A pairing bonus.
Some may prefer give +1 on Defense only when paired to a Tank but this unit will be much more appealing if it get +1A also.
I think it will be nearer the historical records about all kind of Mechanized Artillery.
Germany for instance built a lot of them and even much more than Tanks during WWII, specially StuGIII type.
And during the game, it will be a way to get an optimized built by having a Mechanized Artillery paired to an already existing Tank.
It will follow the same progression than WWII, this unit getting more and more popular as the war evolved.In itself it will be weaker (A2D2C5) but cheaper than medium Tank (A3D3C6).
But was useful for both Infantry unit and Tank as support unit.
And dangerous against Tank, hence gaining the bonus on A/D making them as valuable than a regular Tank but keeping the need to buy Tank to get Mechanized Artillery such a useful unit on offense and defense.I also learned that during WWII both Artillery division (supporting Inf) and Panzer division were having struggle with the Army Chief Command over StuG being part of their unit instead of the other.
Even this aspect can be depicted by the dual bonus for being paired to Inf and MechInf or with Armor.
**With the addition of Mech Infantry in the 1940 versions, and after playing a fair amount, I feel there is a final land unit needed to round out the mechanized units:
Assault Guns, or Self-Propelled Artillery.**
Cost 5 IPCs, act exactly as Artillery, Move 2.
Historically, it doesn’t take much research online to find all the historical precedent you want - especially for Germany and Russia, the former of which built more Assault Guns than Tanks in WWII. If people are interested, I can post some stats to justify their existence in this game.
The unit would be a great complement to Mech Infantry, and can race to catch up with regular Infantry and give them some punch on the front. At 5 IPCs, they’re expensive enough for people to not exploit them, but not so pricey you’d lose too much sleep losing them on the front.
Any thoughts?_**
Now people, you finally get two complete units rosters from Baron.
Any general comments?
Playable or unplayable?
Which one could you prefer?
The 2-planes carrier unit roster with Fighter A3 D4 at 8 IPCs hitting enemy’s planes with “1” or “2” rolls
and AAA rolling @1 every combat round against up to 1 plane?
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=35173.msg1368558#msg1368558
Or
the above 3-planes carrier unit roster with Fighter A2 D2 at 6 IPCs, hitting enemy’s planes first
and AAA acting as OOB against up to 3 planes, plus rolling @1 every combat round against up to 1 plane, if still any?
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=35222.msg1370798#msg1370798
This time, I cannot ignore the most recent idea : a new way of seeing Submarines unit (A3 D1 M2 C8) which can be put into play without any additional specifications on planes against submarines.
The cost has been rise at the same level as Destroyer.
If you look carefully at this cost structure, you will see that this Submarine unit will not be use as a simple sea-fodder, especially on defense.
This makes obsolete the need to pair planes to at least 1 destroyer in a gamey way to prevent that Sub unit to become a much better sea-fodder than Destroyer (as it was OOB at 6 IPCs).
Re: Simplifying units interactions of Transports, Submarines, Destroyers & planes
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34290.msg1371539#msg1371539
Re: Reality wrecking destroyer rules need a revamp…
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34169.msg1371340#msg1371340
Here is the most preeminent 9 features which revised actual units combat value and interaction in play:
First of all, all casualties are now chosen by the owner (except for Fg and Subs) and there is no specific order for any units, including Transports.
Anti-Aircraft Artillery defending as OOB in the first round, but also working as other ground units in following rounds: firing every round @1 but still only against aircraft units,
Fighter A2 D2-3 M4 at 6 IPCs (hit plane first) (Sub is the only other unit with specific target casualty) and
a weaker Tactical Bomber A2-3-4 D3 M4 C8, with increase attack value in Air Supremacy situations,
this makes two different planes with distinctive functions.
This fighter unit (remotely related to his 1914 counter-part) is the long awaited answer to this question: “why planes can’t hit planes in A&A?”
This also includes a more historical Strategic Bombing Raid escort and intercept combat values: in which Fighter gets A2 D2-3 and all Bombers A1.
3-planes Aircraft Carrier (able to carry whether up to 3 Fighters or Tactical Bombers), for increasing possible air-sea actions in SZ.
A costlier Submarine A3 D1 at 7 IPCs with same offensive and lesser defensive combat value compared to OOB but an increase elusiveness against Destroyers,
Destroyer A2 D2 blocking submarines’ Surprise Strike as OOB, but 1:1 for Submerge (1 round only) and Stealth Move
In addition, any hit by planes against submarines is treated normally: planes no more need special presence of Destroyer to hit submarine,
Transport able to defend: A0 1D1 maximum per TPs group, 1 hit, at 8 IPCs and get a combat value which simplify interactions with other units.
A reduced cost structure for warships mostly based on Advanced Shipyard Tech,
keeping the OOB scale cost ratio between warships, such as 1 DD+ 1 CA= 1 BB or 2 DDs = 1 G40 CV.
Increasing Naval actions while keeping a high 8 IPCs for this transport unit, thus making it a more expensive sea-fodder (if someone choose to use them as such).
Also, it contains 5 additional units from HBG (to get a more complete historical roster of weapons) such as:
Anti-Tank Gun A1 D3 M1 C4
Mechanized Artillery A2-3 D2-3 M2 &
Heavy Artillery A3 D2 M1 which become both substantial and competitive units at 5 IPCs,
Escort Carrier D1, carrying 1 plane (Fg or TcB) (an historical 1/3 ratio of Fleet Carrier capacity) with Anti-Sub Vessel capacity same as Destroyer
Medium Bomber (2-engines, working as OOB Strategic Bomber at a lower 10 IPCs) &
Heavy Bomber (4-engines at 12 IPCs with extended range) (HBG sculpts can complete OOB sculpts mix of 2-engines and 4 engines bombers).
So, now you get my ALL-STARS complete A&A units historical roster incremented scale by 1 IPC from 3 IPCs to 10 IPCs, then 12, 14, 16 IPCs, and a smoother game mechanics.
It is as balance (within itself, IMO) and as close as possible from historical feel dynamics without too much sacrifice toward complexity.
I hope you will comment this whole A&A game changer (and feel free to talk about any features below you ever tried in your own F2F A&A game).
The more interesting feature is the Fighter unit at same cost with Tank.
It is more able to figure the usefulness of both Tank and Fighter (2 mains driving machine-weapons of WWII) on the battleground, not just Tank, and make them equivalent loss, from IPCs POV.
Tank (A3 D3 M2 C6) gets a better offensive and defensive punch and can be shielded by AAA, Infantry, Mechanized Infantry, Artillery, Mechanized Artillery and Heavy Artillery units as fodder.
Fighter (A2 D2-3 M4 C6) is more versatile on Sea / Air / Land but have a lower offensive and defensive punch than Tank, and is unable to conquer land territory by itself while being directly vulnerable to AAA unit and other Fighter.
This is a summary of their special abilities (some are house rules I already used and tested):
ANTI-AIRCRAFT ARTILLERY A0 D0 NCM1 Cost 3, 1 hit,
Up to 3 preemptive defense @1 against up to 3 planes,(as OOB AAA) and
fire regular defense @1 against up to 1 plane on the following combat rounds.
Stop any blitz, but cannot defend itself against enemy’s ground units.
INFANTRY A1-2 D2 M1 Cost 3
Get +1A if paired 1:1 with Artillery or Mechanized Artillery or Heavy Artillery
MECHANIZED INFANTRY A1-2 D2 M2 Cost 4,
Get +1 if paired 1:1 with Artillery or Mechanized Artillery or Heavy Artillery
Can Blitz when paired 1:1 with a Tank
ARTILLERY A2 D2 M1 Cost 4
Gives +1A to 1 Infantry or 1 Mechanized Infantry
(ANTI-TANK GUN) A1 D3 M1 Cost 4 added for completeness
Gives +1D to 1 Infantry only, no Mechanized Infantry
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=35315.msg1380075#msg1380075
(HEAVY ARTILLERY) A3 D2 M1 Cost 5 added for completeness
Gives +1A to 1 Infantry or 1 Mechanized Infantry
(MECHANIZED ARTILLERY) (Self-Propelled Artillery / Assault Gun) A2-3 D2-3 M2 Cost 5 added for completeness
Gives +1A to 1 Infantry or 1 Mechanized Infantry when paired 1:1 with.
Tank Hunter as a Tank Support capacity: gets +1A/D when paired 1:1 with a Tank.
Both bonus can work at the same time.
TANK A3 D3 M2 Cost 6
Can Blitz
Allow Mechanized Infantry or Mechanized Artillery to Blitz on 1 on 1 basis or a 1:1:1 basis.
Gives +1A/D to Mechanized Artillery when paired 1:1 with
Gives +1A to Tactical Bomber when paired 1:1 with
FIGHTER A2 D2-3 M4, same in SBR Cost 6
Air combat unit, Fighter as an Air Superiority aircraft: All hits are allocated to aircraft units first, if any available.
Combined Arms Bonus: Gives +1 Attack to any Tactical Bomber paired 1:1 with.
Fighter as part of an extended Air Defense System:
Up to 3 Fighter units receive +1 Defense if protecting a territory with an operational Air Base, (or 1 Fg for a Victory City if playing 1942.2)
SBR/TcBR Attack @2, Defend @2, or even Defend @3 for up to 3 Fgs if an operational Air Base is present.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
SUBMARINES A3 D1 M2 Cost 7
Surprise Strike, (blocked when at least 1 Destroyer or Anti-Sub Vessel is present),
Submerge, instead of rolling for a Surprise Strike attack (blocked by ASV on a 1:1 basis for the first combat round only),
Stealth Movement: No Hostile Sea-Zone (except ASV can block Submarine Stealth movement on 1:1 basis),
Cannot hit airplanes,
Can hit Transports before Warships (even when there is other escorting warships, but it is the owner’s choice to pick or not Transport unit as casualty).
(Added to recreate opportunity for an Atlantic Battle in 1942.2 and also to reduce the effectiveness of Submarine on offense against Destroyer and costlier warships.)
Can be hit by planes, doesn’t require an Anti-Sub Vessel.
Re: Reality wrecking destroyer rules need a revamp…
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34169.msg1372793#msg1372793
DESTROYER A2 D2 M2 Cost 7
Anti-Sub Vessel: each ASV blocks Surprise Strike capacity of all enemy’s Submarine units present.
Cancel Sub’s Submerge on 1 DD:1 Sub basis for the first combat round only
(When it occurs, defending Subs rolls a Defense @1 in the first round, and any surviving Subs can submerge at the beginning of the second combat round.)
Cancel Sub’s Stealth Movement on 1 DD: 1 Sub basis for Combat or Non Combat Move, all additional Sub units can perform a Stealth Movement as usual.
TRANSPORT A0 1Def@1 Maximum per TPs group M2 Cost 8, 1 hit
A transports group get a single defense roll @1/round along with defending warships
(for this single defense roll, friendly transports are all considered being part of the same defending player’s group),
and each transport unit can be taken individually as casualty. As long as their is still 1 TP remaining, it can roll this single defense @1.
EDIT:
TRANSPORT A0 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit, taken as last casualty,
Exception: can be picked as a casualty anytime when an enemy’s submarine hit has to be allocated (owner’s choice, as always, to pick or not transport as casualty).
Simplifying units interactions of Transports, Submarines, Destroyers & planes
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34290.msg1320853#msg1320853
@Baron:
Another way to increase a better defense is a compromise for taken last transport A0 D1.
Only Subs hit can be allocated to Transport units before Warships.
This can somehow re-enact sub-warfare against Transport and the Destroyer reactions to attacking Subs.
Must be escorted by a warship when making an amphibious assault in an enemy’s Submarines infested SZ or Transports infested SZ, so to be able to ignore them/ or fight them with combat units.
Otherwise, Submarines and Transports may be ignored during Transport Combat Move or Non Combat Move.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34290.msg1373212#msg1373212
TACTICAL BOMBER A2-3-4 D3 M4 Cost 8
Combined Arms bonus with Fighter, Tactical Bomber as a less vulnerable “Dive” or “Torpedo” Bomber when escorted by Fighter:
**_Gain +1 Attack, when paired 1:1 with a Fighter .
Air Supremacy Bonus, Tactical Bomber as a “Dive Bomber”:
Gain +1 Attack when no enemy’s aircraft is present.
These two bonuses can be added to raise up to Attack @4.
Combined Arms Bonus with Tank, Tactical Bomber as a “Tank Buster”:
Get +1 Attack when paired 1:1 to any Tank. (Similar to G40 OOB bonus)
Air Supremacy bonus can be added to this bonus.
In this case, a lone Tactical Bomber reach Attack @4 as long as it is paired to a Tank and have Air Supremacy.
SBR/TcBR Attack @1,
Allowed to do escort mission of Strategic Bomber without doing Tactical Bombing Raid on Air Base or Naval Base,
Cannot do interception mission on defense,
TcBR damage: 1D6.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
(G40 ESCORT CARRIER) A0 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit, added for completeness
Carry 1 Fighter or 1 Tactical Bomber,
Anti-Sub Vessel, working the same as a Destroyer,
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
(1942.2 ESCORT CARRIER) A1 D1 M2 Cost 8, 1 hit added for completeness
Carry 1 Fighter or 1 Tactical Bomber,
Anti-Sub Vessel, working the same as a Destroyer,
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
CRUISER A3 D3 M2 Cost 9
Shore bombardment @3
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Carrier: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
STRATEGIC BOMBER (2-engines Medium Bomber) A4 D1 M6 Cost 10
Strategical Bombing Raid (SBR*)/ TBR : Attack @1
SBR/TBR damage: 1D6+2 on Industrial Complex, Air Base or Naval Base
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
(High Altitude Strategic BOMBER) (4-engines Heavy Bomber) A4 D1 M7 Cost 12 added for completeness
Strategical Bombing Raid (SBR*)/ TBR : Attack @1
SBR/TBR damage: 2D6 on Industrial Complex, Air Base or Naval Base
If destroyed by IC’s, AB’s or NB’s AA gun, reduced SBR damage: 1D6-1
No damage if destroyed by Fighter interceptor.
Can hit submarines without Anti-Sub Vessel.
Re: Rethinking Air Units
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34502.msg1331015#msg1331015
1942.2 FLEET CARRIER A1 D2 M2 Cost 12, 1 hit
Carry 3 planes (Fgs or TcBs)
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
G40 FLEET CARRIER A0 D2 M2 Cost 14, 2 hits
Carry 3 planes (Fgs or TcBs)
Damaged Carrier can still carry 1 plane.
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Battleship and 1 Cruiser: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
BATTLESHIP A4 D4 M2 Cost 16, 2 hits
Shore bombardment @4
Combined Anti-Air Defense when paired with 1 Cruiser and 1 Carrier: get up to 3 preemptive shots @1 against up to three planes.
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=34985.msg1359001#msg1359001
SBR/TBR escort and intercept combat values:
Fighter: Attack 2 Defense 2 or 3
Tactical Bomber: Attack 1 Defense 0
Strategic Bomber: Attack 1 Defense 0
If you want to increase battle between planes, at least allows 1 single Fighter or Tactical Bomber to land in a just conquered territory (by at least 1 ground unit), as long as it have another extra movement point for landing.
For my part, I would allow 3 types of defensive maneuvers for aircraft.
DEFENSIVE MANEUVERS allowed for 2 or 3 types of aircraft:
Aerial Retreat for attacking planes (all aircrafts can retreat while letting ground units pursuing battle),
Limited Aerial Withdrawal of 1 space in a friendly territory is allowed any round after the first combat round for defending planes up to 2 StBs or 2 TcBs or 2 Fgs.
Limited landing in a just conquered territory (which includes at least 1 ground unit): 2 planes (either Fighter or Tactical Bomber), as long as each units can provide 1 extra movement point for this special landing._**
I like a lot of what you did here, though personally I think I’ll stick to as few changes to the OOB units as possible. But I really like the new unit ideas.
What do you use as fleet and escort carriers? I saw HBG had some large-looking fleet carriers, but I only saw them in axis colors.
I like a lot of what you did here, though personally I think I’ll stick to as few changes to the OOB units as possible. But I really like the new unit ideas.
What do you use as fleet and escort carriers? I saw HBG had some large-looking fleet carriers, but I only saw them in axis colors.
I know this roster probably work better on a 1942.2 Hybrid games with TcBs added.
This could be much complicated at first in G40 game.
It is the result of long process and many discussions and borrowed ideas put together.
The simplest thing which can worth a try, while keeping everything else OOB, is the Sub-Destroyer (A3 D1 M2 C8)-Planes interactions.
You can keep OOB defenseless transport and the OOB cost of all units except the Sub.
Here you can see an example of HBG Casablanca-class Escort Carrier:
http://www.historicalboardgaming.com/HBG-Battle-Pieces–Allies-Supplement-set-UK-Tan_p_1128.html
Hi Baron,
I know it’s been a while since you posted this, but I have been toying with the idea of increasing air-to-air combat in a way that is very similar to what you have presented here.
I think the A2 D2-3 C6 Fighter is a very interesting idea. Having them target other air units before anything else is a simple and effective way to simulate that air-to-air combat. I also like how the combat values would now be the same in SBR (makes things simple).
I also really like how you altered Tactical Bombers to be A2-4 D3 C8. The two attack bonuses really give meaning to the importance to air supremacy.
I am curious to know how these two units have worked for you.
Thanks!
Hi Baron,
I know it’s been a while since you posted this, but I have been toying with the idea of increasing air-to-air combat in a way that is very similar to what you have presented here.
I think the A2 D2-3 C6 Fighter is a very interesting idea. Having them target other air units before anything else is a simple and effective way to simulate that air-to-air combat. I also like how the combat values would now be the same in SBR (makes things simple).
I also really like how you altered Tactical Bombers to be A2-4 D3 C8. The two attack bonuses really give meaning to the importance to air supremacy.
I am curious to know how these two units have worked for you.
Thanks!
It evolves into this roster:
Baron’s HR units charts and set-up for 1941, 1942.2 and AA50
http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=36833.msg1469053#msg1469053
The main reason is because of too many combined arms and bonus for TcBs and Fgs.
Makes for longer combat round and more details to consider to get the correct bonus per combat round.
Since the point was about hitting directly other planes, I simplified the TcB special ability.
That way, combined arms is now reserved to ground units.
So, it is easier to focus on what is specific to Fg and TcB.
I always start combat rounds with preemptive AAA, then these two units (when present) fire, then all other units.
HTH.
Baron
