Victory Conditions

[P-Unit]

I haven’t seen an official answer to this. I saw this vagary after my first reading of the 2e global rules.  Until I hear otherwise I’m going assume the game ends if a side controls the needed number of VCs after France’s turn is over.  The game is long and complex enough as it is, it doesn’t need additional length or complexity.

[Eqqman]

@P-Unit:

Until I hear otherwise I’m going assume the game ends if a side controls the needed number of VCs after France’s turn is over.

I’m still amazed people are coming up with this alternate interpretation.  How can you possibly control for a complete round of play if you didn’t even have enough at the start of Germany’s turn?

[elevenjerk]

Seems to me a complete round of play is pretty self explanatory.  When every team has gone 1 time, that is obviously a complete round.  If Germany takes the final VC and every team goes without taking a VC back, axis win.  If Italy takes the final VC and every team goes without taking a VC back, axis win.  Same formula for all other countries.

[P-Unit]

@A&A:

Axis & Allies is played in rounds. A round consists of each power taking a turn.

Order of Play: Germany -> France
One must assume after France concludes it’s turn that a round is complete.

Nowhere is a Round defined as the start of an arbitrary nation to the start of that same nation. Otherwise, all nations that haven’t gone in that Round would not meet the “each power taking a turn” rule.

That’s why I disagree.

[elzario]

@P-Unit:

@A&A:

Axis & Allies is played in rounds. A round consists of each power taking a turn.

Order of Play: Germany -> France
One must assume after France concludes it’s turn that a round is complete.

Nowhere is a Round defined as the start of an arbitrary nation to the start of that same nation. Otherwise, all nations that haven’t gone in that Round would not meet the “each power taking a turn” rule.

That’s why I disagree.

I think the definition could go either way.

Round (n.)
1. Sometimes, rounds. a completed course of time, series of events or operations, etc., ending at a point corresponding to that at the beginning.
2. Any complete course, series, or succession.

I think the definition of round in the first circumstance supports the France ends the round argument, but the second definition lends support to the “everyone-plays” round definition.

At the end of the day I think it is fair to play whatever definition you like, but as always in my games we always make clear these sorts of rules before play so it lessens arguments down the track.

[elevenjerk]

I think the second part makes it quite clear.  Nowhere does it say that Germany thru France is a complete round, but it clearly states that each country taking a turn is a round.  Just doesn’t seem fair if Italy takes the final VC and the only countries that have a chance to take them back are Anzac and France.  I’m fairly certain that in over 90% of games played those two countries (especially Anzac) wouldn’t have a chance at taking any city back on the Europe theatre.

[elevenjerk]

With that being said I agree with elzario,  the guys playing should decide at the beginning of the game on the definition of a round.

[Jeff28]

I wish Triple A would fix this error.

–Jeff

[Eqqman]

@P-Unit:

@A&A:

Axis & Allies is played in rounds. A round consists of each power taking a turn.

Order of Play: Germany -> France
One must assume after France concludes it’s turn that a round is complete.

Nowhere is a Round defined as the start of an arbitrary nation to the start of that same nation. Otherwise, all nations that haven’t gone in that Round would not meet the “each power taking a turn” rule.

That’s why I disagree.

That definition supports the everyone must play rule.  If a round is defined as each power taking a turn, then to hold for a complete round, every power must have a turn.  If you don’t hold for every power, then that isn’t a complete round.

[P-Unit]

Summoning Mr Krieghund, Mr. Krieghund come in please!  :evil:

[Eqqman]

Quoting from the FAQ thread (http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=28562.msg1062028#msg1062028):

This exact question has been addressed on the FAQ (earlier thread), so I know the correct answer with certainty.

The Axis have to control 8 cities or more (or 6 for Pacific) CONTINUOUSLY for an entire round of play.

Say Italy takes over London for the Axis 8th city on I10.  The Axis will win on I11 if the Allies never take (or re-take) a European victory city at any time between I10 and I11.  If at any time between I10 and I11 the Axis lose a city and dip below 8, the clock has to start all over again at such time as the Axis re-claim an 8th city.  If the Axis get 9 or more cities, they can lose a city and still win on I11, as long as they never dip below 8 at any time.