My signature says it all my friends
my ass has been laughed off. It is lying on the floor considering the best way to re-attach itself.
well done.
Its true that the French helped us during the revolution but we would have won anyway. Two reasons:
1)We won the most important battles of the war without help (Concord, Princeton, Cowpens, Saratoga)
Both are simultaniously spitting on every marine that died on the Omaha beaches.
I dont think the many Marines died at Omaha since it was an Army division at Omaha.
Its true that the French helped us during the revolution but we would have won anyway. Two reasons:
1)We won the most important battles of the war without help (Concord, Princeton, Cowpens, Saratoga)
- The brritish did not have enough troops, resources and money to occuppy/break the back of the U.S.
at the same time, point #2 may be owing to the fact that their resources were previously occupied by France, and Britains were growing increasingly opposed to hostilities. Thanks to France, it was quite difficult for the British to mount a credible resistance to the revolutionaries.
France is entirely responsible for our very existance.
They are not entirely responsible. Saying this takes away from the courage and sacrifice of the men who fought for American independence. Also, many of British people themselves weren’t altogether for the war. It wasn’t exactly popular in England. True, the French did help - like Lafayette - but it wasn’t all from the goodness of their hearts. They didn’t like the way England had a huge empire, and a free America would open up new trade markets.
For example, at my school we have pep rally competitions between the grades. My class had never won a single one, and we’re seniors now. This year we got our act together and really worked for the spirit and motivation to win, and we did. But some people would say the staff rigged the competition. I resent it because it’s like saying we didn’t work our butts off to earn it :evil: The judges can’t mess up the point system, especially when the whole school is looking on.
That’s what attributing the existence of the USA to France is like to me. Those men who worked their butts off to make this country free don’t deserve to have their work entirely credited to someone else.
The logistics problems were enormous. Plus, even then we had a population advantage. Even when the British managed to overrun Georgia and Apture CHarleston, we took it back fairly quickly. WIthout the French it is very possible the war might have draged on another year or two, but we still would have won. As the years went on our army became more and more able to stand up to the British. THey never really could have won.
France is entirely responsible for our very existance.
They are not entirely responsible.
…
That’s what attributing the existence of the USA to France is like to me. Those men who worked their butts off to make this country free don’t deserve to have their work entirely credited to someone else.
You are right….
But on the other hand, you find these quotes that the US are entirely responsible for France and Germany to exist free of Nazism/Communism (depending on who you read).
That is as unfair as the claim that the US only exists because of France.
((Or this “the US and NATO planned to defend Germany for the whole of the cold war”… Ask Alamein or any german, and listen to the bitter irony: the defense would have been a “bomb to ashes”. The defensive line of the western partners were the Rhine, which is most of the border of France and Germany. The French short-range nuclear rockets could not even reach to the german-german border…))
france and germany actually agree on something and germany is the voice of reason :o worlds coming to an end :P
This is an old article (Dec 2001) but it cracks me up.
The differenence is that the Nazis/Commis could and would occupy Western Europe, whereas the British could not put down the American Revolt.
Okay… lets keep France bashing at a minimum… or does not the adage of do on to others what others would have onto you don’t apply. :wink:
Anyways no one ever makes fun of Spain or Portugal or Poland…
@TG:
Okay… lets keep France bashing at a minimum… or does not the adage of do on to others what others would have onto you don’t apply. :wink:
Anyways no one ever makes fun of Spain or Portugal or Poland…
How things change . . . .
You don’t remember the “good old days”? When a “dumb Polack” joke was as politically correct as “dumb American”/Newfie (from Newfoundlander) jokes are today?
Also i make fun of Spain when i’m in Portugal. There’s just no point in making fun of Portugal tho’. Kind of like kicking a puppy . . . .
(also i’m hoping to move there one day 8) )
The differenence is that the Nazis/Commis could and would occupy Western Europe, whereas the British could not put down the American Revolt.
I see no difference. We aided them in their wars, they aided us in our war. The British could and did put down an American revolt, however they could not keep the pressure up on the Americans when the French joined in and started attacking British interests outside of America.
Say! What’s with us naming all the good stuff for them? French fries, French pastries, French Onion Soup, French’s Mustard, French curls(or is it braids or both?), French kisses, French poodles(Wait! Skip that one!!!)
CAN’T WE THINK OF SOME OTHER NAMES FOR THESE THINGS?!
Like CRAP!
@Xi:
I heard there was a nasty commentary on French Military History on the Web. As in… they have an abissmal W-L record. I looked, but I couldn’t find it. I know they got beat in the early part of the Viet Nam War or whatever they called it. And, of course, they neeeded help in WWI and WWII. They lost the French and Indian War, as we call it. They lost England when that French Knight Dude said, “I vant doobie Kink(or whatever)!”
I think the only victory they were given credit for was the French Revolution in which they beat themselves(or as the victors always say, “The good guys won :P !”Say! What’s with us naming all the good stuff for them? French fries, French pastries, French Onion Soup, French’s Mustard, French curls(or is it braids or both?), French kisses, French poodles(Wait! Skip that one!!!)
CAN’T WE THINK OF SOME OTHER NAMES FOR THESE THINGS?!
well, Napoleon did well for himself for a while, making quite a name for himself. Also don’t forget about Charlemagne, who did well for the French (Franks, at the time), uniting much of western Europe, defending “France’s” borders against the Moors and Saxons. Finally there is (what i consider to be) the most important battle in the history of (at LEAST English) civilization - the Battle of Hastings - where the Normans defeated the English back in 1066. As for recent French conquests, well, their Imperiallist record, the FFL all speak for themselves in various ways.
At the same time, I consider the Arc de Triumph very Ironic - the only armies to march triumphently through it were the Germans and the Americans . . . .
Ya, c_c_,
Charlie was a cool dude at fightin’ an’ unitin’!
However,Napi won battles, but he lost the WAR.
And the Franks got to W Eur by being pushed outa E Eur, didn’t they?
Besides, what’s with the Franks-Normans thing? Did one lil groupa French-to-bes want all the glory, so it wasn’t called a Frank-or-whatever-they-called-themselves back then?
@Xi:
Ya, c_c_,
Charlie was a cool dude at fightin’ an’ unitin’!However,Napi won battles, but he lost the WAR.
And the Franks got to W Eur by being pushed outa E Eur, didn’t they?
Besides, what’s with Franks-Normans thing?
Did one lil groupa French-to bes want all the glory, so it wasn’t called a Frank-or-whatever-they-called-themselves back then?Oh, I guess they weren’t united by Charlie yet, nevermind :cry: !
charlie was a 780’s kinda’ guy
The British could and did put down an American revolt,
By the end of the southern campaign, the British had New York and Yorktown, and that is all. The British were losing thousands a year and making no permanent gains. How could they win?
(I wrote a few pages of text before this, but its late and it was just a rant, so heres the short version)
In short:
American victories without French aid:
Concord
Bunker Hill
Trenton
Princeton
Saratoga
Cowpens
British victories:
Battle of New York (including Fort Lee and Fort Washington)
Battle of White Plains
Battle of Quebec
Battles of Philidelphia
Battle of Charleston
Battle of (Can’t remember name, Gate’s last battle)
Battle of Savannah (spelled wrong)
Until the French aid arrived, the British were winning easily. Saratoga was their only real defeat, the others were merely dents. It took the French navy to defeat the British. It took French money to keep the American army from open mutiny. It took French ammunition and guns to keep the Americans fighting.
Yes, we won the war. Yes, we won it in part because of the courage and sacrifice of great people. But without the French, we would never of come close to winning.
“Franks” was the name applied to a very diverse group of Germanic (and later Germanic/Romanic) people who migrated into Gaul in large numbers between the 5th & 6th centuries. They actually conquered North Italy and much of modern-day Germany & won important victories against the Moors in Spain. When Charlemagne died he left his empire to his surviving son, whose sons in turn divided it up among themselves. This began the traditional division of “Germany” & “France” as separate political units (& often rivals)…
Vikings conquered large tracts of land on the Northern coast of France and settled there (hence the name “Normandy” originally from “Norsemen” or “Northmen”) They mixed with the old Germanic/Romanic Frankish population & became a more-or-less separate “Norman” people who travelled about conquering and adventuring in various areas of Europe (including Italy, England & the Middle East). They were eventually reassimilated into “mainstream” French culture.
I think referring to the French or Germans as wimps for being “afraid” to attack Iraq is shortsighted. Both countries have powerful interests in Iraq & don’t want a war unless they have to. Also both countries are itching to display their independence from US policy–which is a big reason they have been working so hard for a European Union. I think we need to go take out Saddam as well, but don’t accuse a nation of being “wimps” just 'cuz they don’t agree with us. If it’s worth doing it’s worth doing it without them, if not–well, it’s not.
Ozone27
