Anyone tried KIF (Kill Italy First)

[the spaceman]

Hi all,

Tossing some ideas around for a posible alllied strategy. Basically the consensus seems to be that the Japan monster cannot be stopped and that Allies are somewhat disadvantaged. I tried to come up with an effective counter to the basic axis opening.

Here’s a basic run down of my strategy.

Russia.
1. Hold the factory line. Russian units can go straight into battle, German ones must walk for 4 turns or drive long way. Better to pull back then to loose units by trying to defend everything.
2. Be ready to snipe or assault as needed. This depends on German Play. Any exposed German positions should be dealt with. Especially around Belorussia.
3. Send approx 8 INF 4 ART 2 TKS to china by round 3-4. Russia is in the best position out of all the allies to support the Chinese and help generate extra free Chinese INF.  China needs to be kept to at least 5 provinces, minimum.
4.  It’s better to concentrate all the Russians together to generate a slow co-ordinated offensive towards Manchuria South of Mongolia. The Northern Russian troops can gradually pull back and stay out of range of Jap INF/ FTR Combos.
5 Build mainly ART and a few TKS to start off with. It’s important to be able to push the Germans back with a decent  offensive punch. Russia already has tons of INF. Once the Western Front has stabilised some BMR may help the China push
4. Aim to be in position to grab the 10 point bonus NO by turn 4 FIN/ NOR/ BAL/ RUM/ POL

UK.
The UK is the critical partner in this strategy. The UK will concentrate solely on limiting the forces Germany can send East. I have selected Poland as the critical territory for UK to capture by about T3 or 4 depending on how things go. T1 and 2 Surviving UK transports will try to mop up Scandinavia, then by T3-4 they should be landing 8 units a turn somewhere on mainland Europe.
UK t! build will be CV, BB and DD. This links up with surviving fleet if any to create an insurmountable sea defence. Turn 2 builds 3 transports and the ground/air units.

T1
1. Bring Trans Jordan Units to India on transports
2. Surviving Units from Egypt (if any) to Persia/India
3. Send Aust ART + INF to India
4. Send Aust DD to New Guinea as blocker
5. Bomb German Fleet BMR + 2 FTR
6. Send Surviving Fleet to SZ 7
7. Invade NWE if empty/lightly defended
8. Build AC, BB, DD (42)

UK 2
1. Invade Norway
2.  Reinforce India (should be 7-9 inf/tk/2art/ftr)
3. Build 3 Tran 5 Inf

UK 3
1. Invade Poland or Baltic States with 8 Land units/ 2 ftr /BB
2. Invade Finland
3. Push back into Burma, but only if China strong with Russian support also.
2 Build all 8 possible land units (depends on income)
UK 4
1. Hit France as hard as you can
2. Build 8 more land units

US. The us will focus on building land units and transporst en mass for african invasion  whilst moving the pacific carrier to africa and the possible build of a second carrier. The aim is to have at least 10 land units in africa by T3. From then the US has 3 basic options depending on the overall strategic picture.

1 Consolidate in africa by sending more units and expanding into various african territories captuerd by axis
2 Target Rome. Drop 8 land units with fighter and bomber support into Rome on Turn 4
3. On to India. Either set up further transport chains or focus on tanks driving through to india to confront the Japs.

US 1
AC /DD/BB to Atlantic
Build 8 INF 4 ART
US 2
Fleet Link up and invade congo
Build 5-7 TRN (+ INF/ART with change)

US 3
1. 10-14 units land in Morocco (+Gib if previously taken by axis)
2. Build 2nd AC? And/or more INF/ART units transporst  for Second push into Africa or go pacific from here.

US 4
1. 2 BMR 2 FTR + 4 ART/4 INF To Italy or Balkans
2. Build more INF /ART for Africa/Asia

By turn 4 the German/Italian position collapses. The Germans can’t retake France and liberate Italy on the same turn. This will lead to at least one Allied factory on the mainland to pump out tanks and a rapid fall of Germany itself.

[special forces]

I think your effort deserves some feedback, so i’ll give it a shot:

T1
1. Bring Trans Jordan Units to India on transports

With an agressive japanese player there probably won’t be any transport left. They’ll have to walk.

Send Aust ART + INF to India

Doing this in 41 in turn 1 seems hard, even in 42 where there is a transport behind Australia. They’ll have to swim.

5. Bomb German Fleet BMR + 2 FTR

Is good, but this will also depend on G1’s buy. A German aircraft carrier is not an unusual thing to see appear. If Germany buys no fleet, i agree you should try to take it out fast.

6. Send Surviving Fleet to SZ 7

Another option is, when Germany has attacked SZ2 with 2 subs + bomber  + fig, is to gather your remaining fleet (should at least have 1 DD left) to SZ including airforce, taking out the subs and joining there with your fresh fleet. You have no transporters yet, so that position is more faraway, yes, but also more safe.

Although dropping an inf or 2 in Holland is not bad, you do leave 1 or 2 german subs alone. If Germany has bought some fleet in turn 1 it might as well come and get you with remaining subs, fleet and airforce. Risky, but can be lethal (again it depends on the remaining fleet in turn 1)

2.  Reinforce India (should be 7-9 inf/tk/2art/ftr)

Only with a friendly Japanese who didn’t go get your transports (and hasn’t place an IC in Indochina).

But ok, if you manage to get reinforcments here, do you plan to buy an Indan IC?

I think your tactic works only against a japanese player that goes north and ignores the money islands.

US. The us will focus on building land units and transporst en mass for african invasion  whilst moving the pacific carrier to africa and the possible build of a second carrier. The aim is to have at least 10 land units in africa by T3. From then the US has 3 basic options depending on the overall strategic picture.

i like your idea, but you’re leaving some nice bonusses (also for UK which can really use it, especially if Axis have temporary freedom in Africa) and islands in the Pacific.

Also, if Japan is pushing to India from the start, and Germany is succesful in the eastern front (with some italian can-openers around) then pushing through Africa is nerve-wreckingly slow.

Have you ever considered an IC in brasil? once you get a transport there you have a fast connection between Brazil and Belgian Congo. 1 inf + 1 tank (going by 1 transporter) + 1 fig who will just fly over. For African campaigns i have found it to be useful. A brasil fleet can also reach France and pose a potential threat there, even if they never actually attack it. Or reinforce the brits if they took it (unless italy took it back)

US 2
Fleet Link up and invade congo

You mean turn 3, no?  (or you mean in the 42 scenario: 2 transports + 2 DD’s? i’m mostly responding from a 41 standpoint). If so, a Brasil IC in turn 1 (placing units in turn 2 that can be moved to Congo turn 3) might make sense.

By the way, if UK builds its fleet in SZ8, you have the option to send your first US transporter to the new Brittisch fleet there, following them and pooping 2 american units where UK has taken some land the next turn (norway). On the other hand, if you’re dedicated to go for Africa, then you don’t need to do this. Can’t do everything.

By turn 4 the German/Italian position collapses. The Germans can’t retake France and liberate Italy on the same turn. This will lead to at least one Allied factory on the mainland to pump out tanks and a rapid fall of Germany itself.

No offence, but i think the Axis here would have been played pretty bad for all this to work this easy and quick.

Apart from this i’m happy to see some general Allied plans in detail and i know that it is not easy coming up with this, partly because they can depend on what Axis is doing.

Ah and to answer your question: yes i tried a KIF once, but it didn’t end so well for me :) In my case because Japan turned into an unstoppable monster.

[the spaceman]

hi, thanks for feedback.

I agree with many of the points you brought up. and here’s an answer to a few questions you raised.
1. Brit Pacific/Indian ships are as good as dead, but if there are a few lucky rolls then maybe one or two may survive.
2. German subs must be dealt with. I would assume that the German player would lose these as first casualty on turn 1
3. Any british troops making it to india are bonus ones. I would assume Jap takes Island t1 australia t2 and then goes for india push t3-4. A more aggressive Jap player may go for india early in which case they might not have the numbers to hold vs russian push south.
4. The us AC should make it to Africa turn 2 to link up with the tranny this aims to cut off any german/italian units pushing south west.
5. No indian IC. The Brits will focus purely on getting troops ashore to take the heat off the Russians. The Russian then can reclaim the Chinese territories to help generate more free infs.

[ozimek1]

Props for trying to come up with somthing original.

It’s funny that you call this strategy KIF, when the most controversial (and thus the obvious signature maneauvre) move is sending a bunch of Russians againts the Japanese in China. Actually this seems rather counter-productive if the main aim is to quickly break the neck of one of the European Axis.

Are you sure the US should send their Pacific fleet to the Atlantic? I mean the Russians are putting a significant pressure on the Japanese war effort on the Asian mainland, so perhaps a small US fleet in the area could achieve something relatively easily? I mean, since the Japanese will have to invest more ressources in the land war, it will be more difficult for them to counter any US fleet activity.

Also, I prefer to buy at least one UK transport in UK1. You can place it in a Luftwaffe-safe spot on UK1, use it UK2 vs. Norway/NWE/France, and cover it with a defensive naval purchase at the end of UK2.

[special forces]

One more question: since this is a KIF, sooner or later you will have to deal with the italian fleet, would you leave that a job for the US or the UK? (or is that decided as the game goes along?)

[the spaceman]

Hi all,

Are you sure the US should send their Pacific fleet to the Atlantic? I mean the Russians are putting a significant pressure on the Japanese war effort on the Asian mainland, so perhaps a small US fleet in the area could achieve something relatively easily? I mean, since the Japanese will have to invest more ressources in the land war, it will be more difficult for them to counter any US fleet activity

US Pacific Push would get started around T3-4. Ie the AC build could easilly be west coast. It would have limited objectives initially. This would be the recapture of Hawaii/ midway and screening US West coast for a few turns. Unless the Germans/Italias sink the atlantic navy the East coast is limited to land units only and from about T5 the hope is to be building in italy itself. Us trans operating in med can ship units to confront Japs if possible.

One more question: since this is a KIF, sooner or later you will have to deal with the italian fleet, would you leave that a job for the US or the UK? (or is that decided as the game goes along?)

I’d thought about this a bit. Obviously there’s no absolute rule as this depends a lot on enemy moves. I would consider leaving it alive a bit longer to weaken the defence of italy. IE any troops in Africa mean less to defeat on the mainland of europe.

[special forces]

@the:

I would consider leaving it alive a bit longer to weaken the defence of italy. IE any troops in Africa mean less to defeat on the mainland of europe.

Indeed, i feel the same way about that (but sinking that fleet can be so tempting as well)

[Dracnum]

The best thing I have found that keeps Japan in check is having the US Build a factory in Alaska and place navy armada in seazone 64.
This does a couple of things:
    Bombers placed in Alaska can strategic bomb Japan.

The US can threaten to invade Japan during the next turn.

The US can land units in Russia and threaten Japans Asia control.

Most importantly it forces Japan to keep buying a navy instead of ground units in order   
    to protect Japan.