We have a cheap fodder piece against air units. The Destroyer. It’s the submarine of AA50.
Perhaps the escort carriers could cost 8 IPC, Att 0, Def 1, Carry 1 Fighter, Move 2.
The solution is not to change the OOB pieces values. These were created and fit into a system whereby the alteration of one value may have an undesired effect on others. The only thing is to invent pieces inside of the current values.
Escort carrier is a decent idea, but since the real carrier is 14 IPC, perhaps 8 ipc will be great for a 0-1-2 unit with 1 fighter
Light cruiser would be a 2-3 unit moving 2 and a 1 @ SB, costing 10 IPC
Now we have two other units:
Mechanized Infantry:
2-2-2-4 unit can carry one inf or art one extra space at 1:1 basis
Fighter-Bomber:
3-2 unit costing 8 that SBR @ 1/2 rate
Fighter interceptors:
2-3 unit costing 8 that can immediately assist any adjacent attacked territory on the defense ( using its 3 value)
Heavy or Elite Armor:
4-5-2 unit costing 8. you can only build one per turn.
Can’t have mechanized infantry, it’s a technology.
I’d replace that idea with Commandos:
Call them marines, commandos, stormtroopers, whatever.
Idea:
Cost 4
Attack: 2
Special Attack: 3 First Round of Amphibious Assault
Defend: 1
Move: 1
With technology they could move 2 when coupled with an Armor (Mechanized Infantry)
Treated like Infantry in regards to Paratroopers and Transports.
@Cmdr:
Can’t have mechanized infantry, it’s a technology.
Well that depends on how much is going to be changed, is their going to be a whole new tech chart?
having a mechanized infantry peice i think adds alot, but i think tech changes should be agreed upon before changing other things,
also, commandos are such a small scale unit, you could argue marine corp, SS, or Guard units should be in the game but not commandos/rangers
I was reaching for names. That’s why I said we could call them Marines, Commandos, Stormtroopers, your SS, Russian Bears, whatever.
I’m gunna start putting together a beta AA50e (enhanced) this weekend, maybe even finish it off tomorrow.
Well for starters this thread has already outlined the new techs. Thats why you see some of the national advantages indicating such things as paratroopers.
I have playtested my rules and its really fun option
Also i have a new idea:
Battlecruisers are a better choice than light cruisers ( use the Milton Bradley battleships)
This is …drum roll… a 4-4 unit but takes just one hit to sink! I know this is brilliant!
So forget the light cruisers…these new units could represent pocket battleships, and older battleships.
I suggest the starting German Cruiser in 41 and 42 is this Battlecruiser. I suggest the cost be at 14 IPC and it can shore bombard at 4.
@Cmdr:
We have a cheap fodder piece against air units. The Destroyer. It’s the submarine of AA50.
Perhaps the escort carriers could cost 8 IPC, Att 0, Def 1, Carry 1 Fighter, Move 2.
I’m sorry, but with the cheaper Bombers (which I do like), Transports which can’t soak hits, AND the fact that an air force attack against a naval force can’t hit Subs, the air wins every time (as far as IPCs are concerned) against the nerfed navy. Yes, naval units are cheaper, but basically in every AA50 game which my group has played, the navys of the world have been gobbled up by air units. (Yes we do play with techs, so Long Range, Jet Fighters, and Heavy Bombers all helped in this destruction.) So, either unit costs should be lowered a little more, or if we want to keep the OOB units as they are, then just add a cheap “fodder” unit.
I agree that if you have the escort carriers, 7-8 IPCs is much more realistic than 10.
I also like IL’s Pocket Battleship/Battlecruiser idea.
Escort carrier:
is 8 ipc and 0-1-2 unit with 1 fighter capacity
Battlecruiser/Pocket Battleship:
Would be a 4-4 unit moving 2 and a 4 @ SB, costing 14 IPC, takes 1 hit.
Mechanized Infantry:
2-2-2-4 unit can carry one inf or art one extra space at 1:1 basis
Fighter-Bomber:
3-2 unit costing 8 that SBR @ 1/2 rate
Fighter interceptors:
2-3 unit costing 8 that can immediately assist any adjacent attacked territory on the defense ( using its 3 value)
Heavy or Elite Armor:
4-5-2 unit costing 8. you can only build one per turn.
Commandos or elite infantry are a (3)- first round 2-2 unit. These move 4 spaces and this may include up to one water space. They attack to the death and can allocate unused movement points left over to “run away” they cost 8 IPC
Note: these can be sent to attack naval targets as well ( think Italian frogmen or British at St. Nazaire)
Elite infantry idea #2: Representing Shock troops, Waffen SS, Guards
2-3 unit cost 4 move 1, can be boosted like infantry with artillery at 1:1 basis.
Generals:
Each nation has one general ( or perhaps more including admirals)
the General (or admiral) allows one re roll in combat for a miss each round.
I think we have to come up with a good name and idea for elite infantry if their going to be in the game because Elite armor would already represent most of what is Shock/Guard/Waffen SS is
also, IL are you playtesting these rules with the AARHE combat rules and turn/phase order or just what you have posted on this topic?
Cmdr Jennifer, AA50e beta sounds great cant wait!
I’ve pretty much scratched the idea of an elite infantry unit and replaced it with a fast attack vehicle. (Armored Vehicle, Duece, Half-Track, whatever.)
Cost 4
Attack 2
Defend 1
Move 2
This way you don’t have to kill the Technology for Mechanized Infantry.
I’m also leaning towards all Artillery being treated like Battleships/Cruisers. They fire in Opening Fire and then no longer participate in the battle, instead of increasing an attacking infantry’s roll. (However, they still defend like a normal unit.) Advanced Artillery, then would fire two shots like a Heavy Bomber.
The Pocket Battleship idea isn’t half bad. I’ve already got the map and toolpieces for the units, I can certainly fix up the light cruiser into something a bit meaner looking to represent pocket battleships.
I’ve pretty much scratched the idea of an elite infantry unit and replaced it with a fast attack vehicle. (Armored Vehicle, Duece, Half-Track, whatever.)
Cost 4
Attack 2
Defend 1
Move 2
I scratched it out entirely… too many land units ( 2 types of armor, 2 types of infantry, 1 art)
This way you don’t have to kill the Technology for Mechanized Infantry.
Well for me Mech infantry should not be a technology. Its not an invention, but just motorized transport and light tanks grouped in military formations. It should be standard unit in the game.
I’m also leaning towards all Artillery being treated like Battleships/Cruisers. They fire in Opening Fire and then no longer participate in the battle, instead of increasing an attacking infantry’s roll. (However, they still defend like a normal unit.) Advanced Artillery, then would fire two shots like a Heavy Bomber.
If you do this you need to have a thing where if it rolls a one , the attacker can declare the defending unit hit. Otherwise nobody will buy artillery and you took it out of the game. I don’t see why you want to do this with artillery…remember a turn is like 4-6 months and i am sure they can get a shot off by then.
The Pocket Battleship idea isn’t half bad. I’ve already got the map and toolpieces for the units, I can certainly fix up the light cruiser into something a bit meaner looking to represent pocket battleships.
Its like a cheap way to get that 4 and save the cash to buy a destroyer. I really think its original idea and has a more clean valuation ( 1 hit rather than 2) rather than some 3-3 (2 hit) heavy cruiser idea.
Nah, I think people will still use Artillery. Basically, it can defend @2 if attacked or fire in opening fire @2 (or twice @2 if you have the tech) and the defender won’t be able to return fire against it. You also don’t have to pair it with Infantry so you could technically have 50 Artillery Pieces and 1 Infantry attack and get 51 shots in round 1.
Also, mech inf is a tech if you think of them not as special infantry, but special vehicles to transport the infantry. /shrug. I’m thinking like 2.5 tonnes and jeeps and cattle cars, etc. You know, all the stuff we still use today to transport infantry around enmasse!
And I think the fast attack vehicle is missing in this game. We have tanks, but tanks are SLOW. I’m even considering dropping their movement speed to 1 and letting light tanks or armored vehicles be the only ones that move 2.
And I think the fast attack vehicle is missing in this game. We have tanks, but tanks are SLOW.
ok point taken but what do these formation represent when the game is featuring army sized units. Fast attack vehicle is like some really tactical unit on a scale much smaller than AA.
Tanks moving 2 is the top speed for land units. The game was designed for 1 or 2 MP units
Mech infantry does this job at 2-2-2-4 and you can justify it bringing some slower moving ordinance to battle, because really an army would be 1 Inf, 1 art together and an armor is 1 tank and 1 mech inf together.
@Imperious:
And I think the fast attack vehicle is missing in this game. We have tanks, but tanks are SLOW.
ok point taken but what do these formation represent when the game is featuring army sized units. Fast attack vehicle is like some really tactical unit on a scale much smaller than AA.
Tanks moving 2 is the top speed for land units. The game was designed for 1 or 2 MP units
Mech infantry does this job at 2-2-2-4 and you can justify it bringing some slower moving ordinance to battle, because really an army would be 1 Inf, 1 art together and an armor is 1 tank and 1 mech inf together.
I concur
Yea, I was thinking of slowing the tanks down and having a fast attack vehicle (light tanks, half-tracks, trucks, etc) to replace them. They’d attack worse, defend worse, but that would be compensated for by being able to move twice as fast.
Armor:
Half-Track
And since my idea for Artillery forces them to either move or attack and when they attack they do so in opening fire (like AA Guns) they wouldn’t be on the front lines anyway, this would be a way to bring a Att-2 unit into battle to fire each round.
Meanwhile, the slower tanks would slow Japan and Germany a bit and let the Allies catch up.
slowing tanks down is messing with the DNA of the game. Its too radical.
your basically saying armor which is the focus of penetration attacks, gonna just move 1, while armored cars go 2?
the difference is speed is negligible considering 6 month turns.
I think some of the tanks are faster than some of these halftracks ( M-10 jackson tank destroyer was quite fast)
i think you place too much emphasizes on the slow Tiger II and some really large German types. but in general tanks and armored cars are the same.
http://www.mediafire.com/?yot3fehznth
this is the latest update on my rules after further playtesting.
No, I’m saying armor, which is basically mounted artillery wrapped in a battleship’s hull, moves 1.
Light Armored Vehicles, which is the basis of a lightning quick attack, move two. I might even go so far as infantry should move two as well and only armor and artillery (who have not fired this turn) can move 1.
In fact, I think that’s the next parameter for my test games! Gives teh allies longer to get their stuff in order. :)
inf moving 2 sounds a little nuts, so does regular armor moving 1
how about Heavy armor moves 1 attacks at 4 and defends at 5, that makes more sense
because those units do prepresent the King Tigers and other super tanks
Basically, Taiki, I’m just treating standard armor as “heavy” and introducing a lighter, faster tank.
Infantry could ride on the tank and move two. Armor (not tanks, ARMOR) would be forced to run much slower due to the increased energy needs and slower speeds of the units themselves.
