More activity in pacific?

In fact, China has 4 territories: Sinkiang, China, Kwantung and Manchuria. I don’t like China in A&A. Should be another power, have more territories or a starting IC. It is a shame that in many games China is easily conquered by Japan, when in real life they resisted Japan for 8 years, the first 4 by alone and even when they were divided in Kuomingtan and Communists! A very good reason for doing KJF is saving the chineses and retake their home territories from japanese invaders  :-D

@Craig:

@Cmdr:

That’s my pet peive with AARe.  I don’t like ONLY the Allies having extra VCs.  It’s too hard to lock down a victory.

If you add VCs to Hawaii and Australia and Caucasus then I think you need to add a VC to Norway and Wake Island. (Mainly because the story of wake is so romantic.  7 US Marines holding the entire Japanese invasion force off….<drool>Screw Iwo Jima!  Wake is where it’s at!)</drool>

That is where my VT system is a viable alternative.  There are more VTs in the Pacific making for more action there.

Craig

Yep, as I said there’s many ‘house rules’ that add more value to the pacific, making it a <more>active theatre of war.  Adding victory conditions in the Pacific is one way.  Another way I’ve seen is to alter the value of the Pacific territories.  A second edition rules set from Gamers Paradise made all islands worth $2 (including Philipines) and added $2 to Alaska, mexico and panama.  The base income for Japan and America however did not change.  This had the affect of really hurting if you lost (and didn’t take back) such territories.  The also made the US have to fight in the Pacific or they could lose some major cash as well.</more>

we play china as its own entity, its in enhanced.  the american units stay there and you use american pieces, but china goes after america.  you roll a die and if its a 2, 3, 4, you put that many inf down on a spot.  they defend on two’s, put you need 5 inf stacked to make 1 die roll on attack.  that way they really cant attack out, but its very hard to take over the chinks.  but in enhanced japan gets to use heavy inf on bonzaii attacks.

@Craig:

@axis_roll:

@Craig:

@Cmdr:

That’s my pet peive with AARe.  I don’t like ONLY the Allies having extra VCs.  It’s too hard to lock down a victory.

If you add VCs to Hawaii and Australia and Caucasus then I think you need to add a VC to Norway and Wake Island. (Mainly because the story of wake is so romantic.  7 US Marines holding the entire Japanese invasion force off….<drool>Screw Iwo Jima!  Wake is where it’s at!)</drool>

That is where my VT system is a viable alternative.  There are more VTs in the Pacific making for more action there.

Craig

Yep, as I said there’s many ‘house rules’ that add more value to the pacific, making it a <more>active theatre of war.  Adding victory conditions in the Pacific is one way.  Another way I’ve seen is to alter the value of the Pacific territories.  A second edition rules set from Gamers Paradise made all islands worth $2 (including Philipines) and added $2 to Alaska, mexico and panama.  The base income for Japan and America however did not change.  This had the affect of really hurting if you lost (and didn’t take back) such territories.  The also made the US have to fight in the Pacific or they could lose some major cash as well.</more>

The difference between my VT system and the Enhanced is that I address Jen’s concern of an equal amount of VCs/VTs for both sides.

axis_roll- Did you ever hang out with the Gamers Paradise guy(s)?  They are from the Chicagoland area.

Craig

I have meet the creator/owner of the Gamers Paradise chain (Phil), but he wouldn’t play us…

We’ve won (my partner and I) two Gamers Paradise Expansion tourneys.  One was held at a Gen Con in Milwaukee.  1993? I think…

:-o
  I’m guessing, but all this effort required in the Pacific theatre should cause games to go into the 20 + rounds before a victory can be secured. Who has played these house rules and can either confirm or deny my suspicions?
    :roll:

If a turn is 3 months (which has been suggested by a lot of folks over the years), then a 20 turn game would be not too far off…

@Crazy:

:-o
  I’m guessing, but all this effort required in the Pacific theatre should cause games to go into the 20 + rounds before a victory can be secured. Who has played these house rules and can either confirm or deny my suspicions?
     :roll:

You might think that, but in my experience with the A&ARe (Enhanced) rules, games are usually won/lost by round 10-12.
I’ve seen Revised games (LHTR) last 20+ rounds easily, especially if Germany turtles early and only buys inf, while the Allied player is determined to run KGF… power on power = long war.

@axis_roll:

@Crazy:

:-o
  I’m guessing, but all this effort required in the Pacific theatre should cause games to go into the 20 + rounds before a victory can be secured. Who has played these house rules and can either confirm or deny my suspicions?
    :roll:

You might think that, but in my experience with the A&ARe (Enhanced) rules, games are usually won/lost by round 10-12.
I’ve seen Revised games (LHTR) last 20+ rounds easily, especially if Germany turtles early and only buys inf, while the Allied player is determined to run KGF… power on power = long war.

In my experience AARe games are usually won/lost by round 5.  Dunno why you are holding out until Round 12.  If the axis are doing their job well, then they’ll have the VC needed by Round 5.  Allies don’t stand a chance, they don’t have enough units on the board nor do they have enough income to get enough units on the board to stop it.

@balungaloaf:

we play china as its own entity, its in enhanced.  the american units stay there and you use american pieces, but china goes after america.  you roll a die and if its a 2, 3, 4, you put that many inf down on a spot.  they defend on two’s, put you need 5 inf stacked to make 1 die roll on attack.  that way they really cant attack out, but its very hard to take over the chinks.  but in enhanced japan gets to use heavy inf on bonzaii attacks.

Go make your own game,

This sounds nuts, and places the US in an even worse starting position than before.

@Sproit:

@balungaloaf:

we play china as its own entity, its in enhanced.  the american units stay there and you use american pieces, but china goes after america.  you roll a die and if its a 2, 3, 4, you put that many inf down on a spot.  they defend on two’s, put you need 5 inf stacked to make 1 die roll on attack.  that way they really cant attack out, but its very hard to take over the chinks.  but in enhanced japan gets to use heavy inf on bonzaii attacks.

Go make your own game,

This sounds nuts, and places the US in an even worse starting position than before.

this is mot revised just to tel you

@Cmdr:

In my experience AARe games are usually won/lost by round 5.  Dunno why you are holding out until Round 12.  If the axis are doing their job well, then they’ll have the VC needed by Round 5.

AND YOUR EXPERIENCE IS AGAIN…7 GAMES?

please, let other players at least have the thought of trying Enhanced before you tell them it is broken being so in favor of the axis.  It is my humble opinion that you do not have enough  Enhanced games to be spewing absolutes about the playout of this rule set.

As I already said, I will play the allies and show you just what they can do in an enhanced game.  I’ll even give the axis a $4 bid.

Fight nice folks.

A challenge is fine, insults are unneeded.

@ncscswitch:

Fight nice folks.

A challenge is fine, insults are unneeded.

where was there an insult?

@axis_roll:

@ncscswitch:

Fight nice folks.

A challenge is fine, insults are unneeded.

where was there an insult?

@Sproit:

@balungaloaf:

we play china as its own entity, its in enhanced.  the american units stay there and you use american pieces, but china goes after america.  you roll a die and if its a 2, 3, 4, you put that many inf down on a spot.  they defend on two’s, put you need 5 inf stacked to make 1 die roll on attack.  that way they really cant attack out, but its very hard to take over the chinks.  but in enhanced japan gets to use heavy inf on bonzaii attacks.

Go make your own game,

This sounds nuts, and places the US in an even worse starting position than before.

I am insulted on behalf of squirrels everywhere

@axis_roll:

@Cmdr:

In my experience AARe games are usually won/lost by round 5.  Dunno why you are holding out until Round 12.  If the axis are doing their job well, then they’ll have the VC needed by Round 5.

AND YOUR EXPERIENCE IS AGAIN…7 GAMES?

please, let other players at least have the thought of trying Enhanced before you tell them it is broken being so in favor of the axis.  It is my humble opinion that you do not have enough  Enhanced games to be spewing absolutes about the playout of this rule set.

As I already said, I will play the allies and show you just what they can do in an enhanced game.  I’ll even give the axis a $4 bid.

Strawman.  I don’t have to eat Rubarb Pie more then 7 times to realize I don’t like it.  Actually, I only need to eat it once or twice (since I give food at least two chances to win me over) to determine that.

Same here.  AARe is so hopelessly biased in favor of the axis it would take someone inept to play them or someone truly exceptional to get the allies to win.

You can go to a few different sites and just look at the axis vs allies win/loss record for more evidence, it’s not just my games. (Though it’s hillarious that Germany can afford to buy battleships because the allies can’t do anything to stop them.  Or Japan can focus on bombers for the same reason.)

@newpaintbrush:

@axis_roll:

@ncscswitch:

Fight nice folks.

A challenge is fine, insults are unneeded.

where was there an insult?

@Sproit:

@balungaloaf:

we play china as its own entity, its in enhanced.  the american units stay there and you use american pieces, but china goes after america.  you roll a die and if its a 2, 3, 4, you put that many inf down on a spot.  they defend on two’s, put you need 5 inf stacked to make 1 die roll on attack.  that way they really cant attack out, but its very hard to take over the chinks.  but in enhanced japan gets to use heavy inf on bonzaii attacks.

Go make your own game,

This sounds nuts, and places the US in an even worse starting position than before.

I am insulted on behalf of squirrels everywhere

I want to apologize for my insulting and unappropriated behavior.

I stick to my point that every ship not being Axis in the pacific is a real threat.

@Cmdr:

@axis_roll:

AND YOUR EXPERIENCE IS AGAIN…7 GAMES?

Strawman.  I don’t have to eat Rubarb Pie more then 7 times to realize I don’t like it.  Actually, I only need to eat it once or twice (since I give food at least two chances to win me over) to determine that.

Same here.  AARe is so hopelessly biased in favor of the axis it would take someone inept to play them or someone truly exceptional to get the allies to win.

You can go to a few different sites and just look at the axis vs allies win/loss record for more evidence, it’s not just my games. (Though it’s hillarious that Germany can afford to buy battleships because the allies can’t do anything to stop them.  Or Japan can focus on bombers for the same reason.)

Everything is always black and white with the Jenn glasses on, and I am sorry but you are SOOO wrong with this statement.

Playing Enhanced could never be compared to eating a pie, there are too many possible combinations in the game.

There are 5 National Advantages for each country.

Germany and Japan can pick 2 from the list.  So just the combinations of Axis National advantages is 10 possible for Germany times 10 possible for Japan.  That’s 100 combinations of strategies, JUST for the Axis.  Don’t forget Tech is much more of an intergral part of Enhanced (with the 4-2 rule) to add even more strategic options to the mix.  Game playout varies almost EVERY game I have played, even using the same NA’s for each side over and over.

If there is ANY version of the game that is one sided, it is the classic version.  Right from the beginning of Milton Bradleys versions, the allies have always been favored to win.  First edition was a joke, Second edition still was a laugh when you consider the axis chances (besides tech, that is), 3rd edition (CD-Rom) was a little better and Revised STILL favors the Allies (note the Axis requiring $6-9 to ‘even’ things up).

I have already challenged you to an Enhanced game with AN AXIS BID of $4.  This is a typical bid in my face-to-face enhanced group.

So either take the challenge to prove your black and white glasses do indeed allow 20-20 vision or stop spewing misinformation about the A&ARe (Enhanced) Rules.

Respectfully,
axis_roll

Guys,

I just think we are loosing the point of this topic,

Axis_Roll, You don’t need to use capitol letters to make your point clear,
You don’t need to say someone has black and white glasses, this doesn’t make sense, everyone has it’s own view, so everyone wears glasses, satisfied?

So please just keep smiling, there are more important things in the world than this forum, or even this game. ;)

@Sproit:

You don’t need to say someone has black and white glasses, this doesn’t make sense, everyone has it’s own view, so everyone wears glasses, satisfied?

“Black and white glasses” means that there is no middle ground, no gray area.

It’s either on or off, up or down….

She is very adamant (almost to a fault) in her opinions that she rarely (if ever) sways in her opinion, even when more than one person shows her opinion to be less than factual (read the German nick pick economizer thread.)

And, you know what, I am ok with that if you have shown you have a basis for your opinions, like you are a good player or have a good understanding of a subject matter in which you profess ‘expert knowledge’.

However, I just do not think that seven games of A&ARe qualifies any player as a source of absolute knowledge such as “The allies have no chance in Enhanced”

And I use capital letters as another form of emphasis besides bold or italics

@Sproit:

Guys,

I just think we are loosing the point of this topic,

Axis_Roll, You don’t need to use capitol letters to make your point clear,
You don’t need to say someone has black and white glasses, this doesn’t make sense, everyone has it’s own view, so everyone wears glasses, satisfied?

So please just keep smiling, there are more important things in the world than this forum, or even this game. ;)

Right.
But one of the possibilities to have more action in Pacific is to use Enhanced rules!

Those rules are intended to have more naval action and battles that involves almost each part of the board. So it is normal that Germany would buy BB and Japan would buy BMB.
It is not a measure of quality for an A&A ruleset if only Allied (really only USA) may buy BB or BMB. So it is not a deficiency it is an advantage!

IMHO Enhanced do not allow to win by simply leveraging production edge and economizing on units. Allied have to fight hard for their lives each turn before it may overcome the Axis. Axis have to move good and quickly to not allow Allies to come back.
In revised, that I still like very much, this “crisis” is not present. In fact to even the game it is required a bid. Allies already have the edge. In Enhanced Allies have to gain this edge on the Axis.