@ABWorsham:
Could any WW2 battleship survive a hit from a tall boy bomb?
The effect of an actual hit on a battleship (as opposed to near misses, Tirpitz having been near-missed by several Tallboys) would depend on the atltitude from which the bomb was dropped (the Grand Slam could reach supersonic speeds if dropped from high enough, and I think the smaller Tallboy could too), on the location of the hit, and on the specific ship. A hit on the deck, right next to (but not on) one of the main gun turrets, would have the best chance of destroying a WWII battleship outright because it would have the best chance of detonating the main ammunition magazines. The Yamatos might just perhaps have been able to survive such a hit, but I doubt that any other WWII battleship had deck armour thick enough to do so…and I’m not even sure about the Yamatos.
A hit elsewhere on most modern WWII battleships probably wouldn’t have been instantly lethal in the same way that a magazine detonation would have been, but would still have been damaging. The least damaging hits would probably be the middle of the forecastle (a non-critical area located outside the armoured citadel), or amidships above one of the torpedo bulkheads (which are built to absorb hits and flood without endangering the rest of the ship). A hit all the way forward that demolished the bow would pretty much immobilize the ship, or at least severely restrict its operating speed, but could perhaps be patched up in a few weeks. A hit on the quarterdeck could be nasty: that part of a battleship is typically large (a big target), unarmoured, and contains the propeller shafts (which are, however, sometimes protected by a strake of armour above them). The best location for a non-lethal but nonetheless permanantly crippling Tallboy hit would be the middle and rear portions of the armoured citadel, if the bomb managed to reach the boilers or, especially, the turbines (big machinery that’s difficult to repair) or the reduction gearing (very sensitive to damage; a handful of metal splinters would be enough to chew them up if the ship was hit while it was steaming).
Very nice response, as usual Marc. Thank you.
On the 11th December 1941, Germany and Italy declared war on the US, who in turn declared war on them.
I also saw (and did not know) that Poland declared war on Japan today.
God knows where from. London I suppose!
Today in 1939 Franco declared the Spanish civil war over. In 1942 Hamburg was bombed by the British.
April 14 1939
Roosevelt wrote to Hitler and Mussolini seeking assurances Germany and Italy would not “attack or invade” any nation with whom it had issues in dispute. Hitler later termed the appeal a meaningless gesture. Mussolini called it absurd.
Britain proposed to Russia that Moscow announce it would respond to requests for aid from any of its neighbors which came under attack
@suprise:
April 14 1939
Roosevelt wrote to Hitler and Mussolini seeking assurances Germany and Italy would not “attack or invade” any nation with whom it had issues in dispute. Hitler later termed the appeal a meaningless gesture. Mussolini called it absurd.
I hate to say it and I know I shouldn’t, but it sounds like something the current US administration would say.
Sorry delete me if you want.
It does sound like something you would hear on the news today. more later
@suprise:
April 14 1939
Roosevelt wrote to Hitler and Mussolini seeking assurances Germany and Italy would not "attack or invade"Â any nation with whom it had issues in dispute. Hitler later termed the appeal a meaningless gesture. Mussolini called it absurd.
This was the famous (or infamous) letter containing the list of countries which Hitler read out (in German, of course) to the Reichstag, provoking giggles at first then roars of laughter as the list got longer and longer: “Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, The Netherlands, Belgium, Great Britain and Ireland, France, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Poland, Hungary, Rumania, Yugoslavia, Russia, Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey, Iraq, the Arabias, Syria, Palestine, Egypt and Iran.” I have the footage of that incident somewhere on a DVD, and as I recall the members of the Reichstag get particularly rowdy when Hitler mentions Lichstenstein (which, it should be noted, is one of the few non-Axis countries in Europe which Hitler never did actually invade). In fairness, the Reichstag by that date was basically – as one of Frank Capra’s narrators once expressed it – “a collection of stooges, rubber-stamping laws and applauding on cue the words of the leaders.”
It would be fun to see an edited copy of that video clip in which, as Hitler rattles off the list, a subtitle states the name of each country in English and indicates its A&A IPC value. Unfortunately, nobody outside the A&A community would get the joke.
April 15 1940
A combined British, French, and Polish force landed near Narvik . It was essentially a diversionary effort, with the hope of maintaining a toehold in Norway. Within 3 days a total of 4 Battalions were ashore in northern Norway
, but were quickly rendered helpless by German aircraft which had established mastery of the skies.
April 14 1939
Romania declared it was unwilling to participate in any anti-Nazi alliance.
@CWO:
@suprise:
April 14 1939
Roosevelt wrote to Hitler and Mussolini seeking assurances Germany and Italy would not "attack or invade"� any nation with whom it had issues in dispute. Hitler later termed the appeal a meaningless gesture. Mussolini called it absurd.This was the famous (or infamous) letter containing the list of countries which Hitler read out (in German, of course) to the Reichstag, provoking giggles at first then roars of laughter as the list got longer and longer: "Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, The Netherlands, Belgium, Great Britain and Ireland, France, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Poland, Hungary, Rumania, Yugoslavia, Russia, Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey, Iraq, the Arabias, Syria, Palestine, Egypt and Iran." I have the footage of that incident somewhere on a DVD, and as I recall the members of the Reichstag get particularly rowdy when Hitler mentions Lichstenstein (which, it should be noted, is one of the few non-Axis countries in Europe which Hitler never did actually invade). In fairness, the Reichstag by that date was basically – as one of Frank Capra’s narrators once expressed it – “a collection of stooges, rubber-stamping laws and applauding on cue the words of the leaders.”
It would be fun to see an edited copy of that video clip in which, as Hitler rattles off the list, a subtitle states the name of each country in English and indicates its A&A IPC value. Unfortunately, nobody outside the A&A community would get the joke.
I’ve seen that video - it is hilarious!
19th April 1943 - Warsaw Ghetto Uprising
Such courage and desperation.
From Wikipedia:
On 19 April 1943, on the eve of Passover, the police and SS auxiliary forces entered the Ghetto. They were planning to complete the deportation action within three days, but were ambushed by Jewish insurgents firing and tossing Molotov cocktails and hand grenades from alleyways, sewers, and windows. The Germans suffered casualties and their advance bogged down. Two of their combat vehicles (an armed conversion of a French-made Lorraine 37L light armored vehicle and an armored car) were set on fire by insurgent petrol bombs.[36] Following von Sammern-Frankenegg’s failure to contain the revolt, he lost his post as the SS and police commander of Warsaw. He was replaced by SS-Brigadeführer Jürgen Stroop, who rejected von Sammern-Frankenegg’s proposal to call in bomber aircraft from Kraków and proceeded to lead a better-organized and reinforced ground attack.
The longest-lasting defense of a position took place around the ŻZW stronghold at Muranowski Square, where the ŻZW chief leader, Dawid Moryc Apfelbaum, was killed in combat. On the afternoon of 19 April, a symbolic event took place when two boys climbed up on the roof of a building on the square and raised two flags, the red-and-white Polish flag and the blue-and-white banner of the ŻZW. These flags remained there, highly visible from the Warsaw streets, for four days. After the war, Stroop recalled:
“The matter of the flags was of great political and moral importance. It reminded hundreds of thousands of the Polish cause, it excited them and unified the population of the General Government, but especially Jews and Poles. Flags and national colours are a means of combat exactly like a rapid-fire weapon, like thousands of such weapons. We all knew that – Heinrich Himmler, Krüger, and Hahn. The Reichsfuehrer [Himmler] bellowed into the phone: ‘Stroop, you must at all costs bring down those two flags!’” —Jürgen Stroop, 1949[8]
The Bismarck sank today, the 27th May, in 1941. She put to sea nine days ago and was on her way to Brest for repairs, when cornered by her enemy. The Royal Navy pulled out all the stops in its hunt for what was one of Germany’s two Battleships. Despite an auspicious start: she sank the old Battlecruiser Hood, and chased off and damaged a newer Battleship, the Prince of Wales, her luck ran out. In the glorious tradition of the Navy, she went down fighting. Of her crew of 2200, only 114 survived.
She was capable of 30 knots and was armed with 8 15 inch guns. Her Belt was 13 inches thick, the turrets 14.
I always loved the story of her short life.
@wittmann:
The Bismarck sank today, the 27th May, in 1941. […] I always loved the story of her short life.
Thanks Wittmann – I agree that the Bismarck’s fateful sortie is one of the greatest sea stories of WWII. These two sites may be of interest:
I looked at those links, thank you Marc.
Today, the 4th June, in 1944 Rome was liberated. It was the first of the three Axis capitals to be captured and was a great propaganda victory. However, Mark Clark, commanding the 5th US Army would have done better to have chased down the retreating German units (as ordered by his superior). Rome fell once the line at Monte Cassino had been breached. The Allies would have to face them at the next defensive line, the Gothic line, in September. Italy would prove a long campaign.
The D-Day landings in Normandy, a.k.a. Operation Overlord, occurred on June 6, 1944, 71 years ago today.
On Twitter, Osprey Books, who I follow, have been doing a diary of the day’s events. I have enjoyed it.
Having watched the excellent video shared by variance on another thread - there were more US casualties on Omaha beach than the whole of the war in Afghanistan. One of those things you know, but still need to be reminded of from time to time.
D Day as a whole incurred just over 4,400 allied dead. It could have been so much worse. I was going to draw a comparison with other battles and wars but that seems disrespectful so I will refrain.
June 10th, 1940: Italy (Mussolini actually) declared war on Britain and France.
No military action took place, however, until the 22nd. And that went badly.
The Germans marched into Paris today, the 14th June, in 1940.
