Balancing and Bidding

I think the game is close to balanced, but there is good reason to think it might not be.

basically, if russia were any weaker (or either axis player any stronger), there might be a high number of games where a) novice players would have a terrible time as russia gets pwned, or b) early bad luck by russia would allow for allied defeat even with superior play.

In other words, if germany has the ability to force a battle early in the game against the least resilient allied power, then even when played badly the axis always have a chance of an upset win in that battle.  The stronger you make the axis initially, the more risk that the game is decided by luck in spite of any allied skill very early on.

Having said all that, I think it’s pretty darn balanced and I’m just suggesting theories for why it might intentionally have been left with some imbalance.

If Russia does WRu/Ukr you can stack Kar even without a European bid in most games. Even if Russia has good odds attacking it, its still a good move since Germany can afford to replace its losses whereas Russia can’t.

personally if i got a 11 ipc bid it would be 1 fig to Germany then 1 ipc to Japan. then i’d build 4 figs as Germany first round. it seems interesting to do.

Wow, what a thread!

I must say, I take NCS’s position on this one for several reasons, the most pertinant of them being that

a) While the Axis certainly CAN win without a bid, when you have players of equal skill and who are equally skilled at playing both Axis AND Allies (not just one or the other side), a bid can certainly make the difference in the early round(s) and many times it’s what happens the first 2 rounds that can help decide the game.

b) figuring out statistics is something that can only be done over thousands and thousands of games. I mean, you can flip a coin 100 times and get 90 heads. Does that mean the odds of getting tails are skewed? No, because if you were to flip that coin 10,000 times or 100,000 times the odds are it would be very close to 50/50 and 1,000,000 times or more and likely the difference would be so negligible as to allow us to say it was 50/50. While we cannot play 1,000,000 AAR games, I don’t think it’s too much of a stretch to suggest that a bid helps even out the game.

You know, just as many of the issues of AA Classic were worked out in AAR, I think probably in the next iteration (or version) that many of the issues we’ve seen here will be worked out as well. Maybe an extra unit here or another territory there… whatever it takes to balance the game.

To me I’m looking for gamebreaking changes in LL that would convince me that it doesn’t have any validity for analyzing overall strategies in ADS. I don’t really get stuck on very small details in very small battles in which we’re talking about efficiency in fractions of IPCs - which either side can take advantage of. I’m looking at the forest, not the trees.

I think it’s something to have to live with, but it’s still better to look at overall strategies than having every other game in ADS screwed over by some important battle going horribly wrong.

You want to replace the bidding system, by allowing an extra NC move before the game begin?

That sounds strange. If you want to eliminated the bidding system, just adjust the starting forces of the Axis, up to a point where the game becomes ‘even’.

My recommendation, to make the game even, would be to:

Add 2 extra inf, to be placed in UKR and +6 Starting IPC to Germany.

…or

Add 3 extra inf in UKR.

Germany would be ready to rock and roll with an extra 8 in Africa…  They would benefit far more than giving the 8 to the Japanese since there is very little to check Japan in the long run in Asia.  The Germans would not need to pull troops from Europe to successfully assault Egypt(closing the Suez-sealing off the Indian fleet), and they’d be able to drop reinforcements to prevent an American counter in US1 in Algeria.  The Germans can go after the Brit BB in the Med with the BB prtotecting the planes(The BB isn’t needed to protect the transport against the Destroyer in the Med when amphibbing Egypt because the amphib isn’t necessary).  The sub could be used to sink the tranny in Canada, hamstrining the Brits efforts in Norway in GB1.  They could move both fleets together in G2… without sacrificing Africa.  And take 4 IPCs off the Brits in G2 as well…  Plus the rest of Africa in G3(would be enough to offset what is lost to US in US2)…  Even if the Allies are aggressive in the first round, there is no reason why Germany would be collecting less than 39IPCs(as opposed to 37) in round1, 42 in round 2, and 44 in round 3.  This almost guarantees that Germany will hang around no less than 7 rounds(more than likely 8 or 9)…  Long enough for Japan to strike down Moscow.

Wilk

@trihero:

I dunno, I’ve been talking with a very good Revised player and he never will play the Axis unless he has a bid of 8 (1 inf in Libya 1 tank in Algeria).

never mind!