Revised Tech. Schedule

[Guest]

Who else finds technology handled poorly in A&A? I know I do. First of all, the techs are very unbalanced as to what’s usable and what isn’t. Second of all, there is a huge chance factor (1/6) in getting ANY tech, then another 1/6 chance you get what tech your strategy has been preparing for. Now most people just went “huh?” Yes, a strategy that incorporates a certain technology, and prepares for it, and has a better chance than 1/36 of getting it. However, that isn’t done too often or too well because of the current tech system. I don’t have anything definite worked up, but here are a few ideas:

1. Better techs, which are all roughly equal in strength OR grouped by strength.
2. A way to research toward a particular tech or group of techs. It’s very unlikely that a lab working on better submarines would stumble upon a jet engine.
3. Cost proportionality - Stronger techs cost more money.
4. Make tech more of a “sure thing.” How would we feel if every attack had a 1/6 chance of succes?

The goal of these changes is to make tech more strategic and used more often. There should still be some uncertainty thrown in, as that makes for edge of your seat excitement, but one person getting a huge payoff from 5 IPC while another person has yet to see anything from 25 IPC is a little too chance based and uneven in my book. If you spend more, you should get more, on average. Just like an attack - you can calculate the probable result and spend what you need to to win, but there is some deviation and unpredictability in how things turn out. Outspending your opponent by 5 times on the battlefield (assuming skill roughly equal) almost always puts you very far ahead and gives you a great chance of winning. Outspending your opponent in the lab by 5 times should also give you a huge edge in research and weapons, but there are too many cases where it doesn’t.

I’ve seen huge, complicated R&D rules and schedules, but let’s remember what we’re after - simplicity. Someone should be able to understand and strategically incorporate your techs the very first time they play. Ultra-powerful or weird, complex techs should be saved for variants. This is an attempt at a new, viable tech schedule to replace the old one.

[Guest]

How about splitting the techs into categories? Then using a better system to roll for techs…like you pick a category and roll to determine which tech you get. Here is an example of categorized tech, but the selection system is TBA.

–Production–
1,2 New IC’s can produce 2(or 3?) additional unit(s)
3,4 Revised Industrial Tech
Unit Cost 1-5 Discount 1 IPC
" " 6-12 Discount 2 IPC
" " 13-20 Discount 3 IPC
" " 20+ Discount 4 IPC
5,6 Future Research is somehow discounted

–Ground–
1,2 One Rocket Per AA gun per turn
3,4 Super Tanks - Defend at 3
5,6 Personnel Carriers - one INF can travel with a matching ARM for a blitz or attack

–Naval–
1,2 Lint Trap(HA!)
1,2 Sonar- Enemy Subs don’t have first strike or submerging ability
3,4 Super(useful) Subs- attack at 3, can shoot down planes, and choose casualty from deadly first shot attack
5,6 Coastal Defense- Roll one die for every attacking SURFACE ship(TRN,BB,AC) in an amphibious assault. For each ‘1’ the attacker loses a boat. This takes place AFTER combat in the sea zone(if any), but BEFORE combat in the land zone zone, therefore TRN sunk before unloading but BB still get support shot.
(possible substitutions include heavy TRN, heavy AC, increased AC attack)

–Air–
1,2 Long Range Aircraft Unchanged
3,4 2 Dice Heavy Bombers
5,6 Air Transports- Any bomber can carry one ARM or 2 INF and drop it into any territory flown over or landed in. The BMB and transported units must start the turn in the same territory, and movement can occur in either combat or non-combat phases, whichever is appropriate

Any feedback is appreciated. Do these techs all seem even or at least usable? I tried to create a low-level, med-level, and high-level tech in each category. Any help in sorting out which is which would be wonderful. And if you have any additions, modifications, replacements, or a whole new system then let’s hear it. Remember-this is an attempt at replacing the current tech system in A&A, so balance, simplicity, strategy, and fun all need to be considered. How does this system do with those criteria?

[Guest]

–Production–
1,2 New IC’s can produce 2(or 3?) additional unit(s)

Aimed at the japanese market primarily? In mid game (when countries are likely to have spare money to afford techs) Jap will have 1, maybe 2 new IC’s, and nobody else will have any. (Indian IC is non-viable in the medium to long term).

3,4 Revised Industrial Tech (similar to existing)
5,6 Future Research is somehow discounted
Okay.

–Ground–
1,2 One Rocket Per AA gun per turn

If I were germany and got this technology, I could fire WEU, GER, and SEU’s AA guns at britain. Result = Britain is out of the game.

3,4 Super Tanks - Defend at 3 (Okay)
5,6 Personnel Carriers - one INF can travel with a matching ARM for a blitz or attack
(Nice, presumably not limited to 1 per turn?)

–Naval–
1,2 Lint Trap(HA!)
1,2 Sonar- Enemy Subs don’t have first strike or submerging ability

In games I’ve played, submarines are rarely used as lone submarines, but rather as cheap fodder for a sizeable battle fleet. Therefore, I’m not sure you need a tech specifically to take them out.

3,4 Super(useful) Subs- attack at 3, can shoot down planes, and choose casualty from deadly first shot attack

Shoot at planes at a 3? Nice idea - bear in mind that they only cost 8 IPC’s each.

Would you like them to carry troops as well, do onshore bombardments and fly? (joke).

5,6 Coastal Defense- Roll one die for every attacking SURFACE ship(TRN,BB,AC) in an amphibious assault.

Ac’s aren’t involved in amphib assaults.

(possible substitutions include heavy TRN, heavy AC, increased AC attack)

This might be a more interesting tech tree - A slight imprvement in units:

Level 1 TRN carry 2 INF, Def 1
Level 2 TRN carry 3 INF, Def 1
Level 3 TRN carry 3 INF, Def 2
and so on…

I would suggest a level system - similar to Civilisation or RPG’s.

To promote a unit to lvl 2 - cost = (cost of unit or 5IPC’s whichever is higher). Chance of success = 50%, and only 1 roll per unit type per turn.

Unit increments would be similar to above - minor and gradual.

For BMB’s:

Lvl 1: range 6 attack 4 def 1
Lvl 2: range 6 attack 4 def 2
Lvl 3: range 8 attack 4 def 2
Lvl 4: range 6 attack 4x2 def 2
…

So to get 2 dice HB’s, it costs 45IPC’s - not cheap, but not the 180IPC’s it costs to guarantee getting HB’s in normal AA.

This schedule also allows people to see what is coming - ie Japan upgrades BMB’s over a few turns, and the allies have a time to respond before HB’s are acheived.

Other ideas might be to purchase Heavy bombers over say 4 turns - Total cost = 60IPC’s paid in equal installments.

Say japan starts the research programme. This means that for the next 4 turns Japan is down by 15 IPC’s per turn doing research. Thus, the allies have a chance of attacking Japan to force it to abandon it’s research program and be left with nothing.

Thus, the person paying pays a fixed cost over a set number of turns, and the opponents can see what is being researched, and thus can respond.

Techs similar to AA, and some extra ones, but with different research time/cost.

What do you think?

[Guest]

Yeah, the personnel carrier tech means each tank can carry one INF, so you can carry as many INF as tanks you have.

Yeah, I definitely like the time sensitive research idea. That way you take a calculated temporary disadvantage to get an advantage that(hopefully) pays off. The whole game is a race and about timing, and techs should support that. I was trying to work it in to my tech system, but couldn’t come up with a simple way.

I think having 3 or 4 levels for every unit (24 or 32 technologies) is too many techs to keep track of. How often is someone going to pay $18(6 INF) over 2 or 3 turns, for a better AC? Or invest in subs?(apparently they DONT fly or launch nuclear warheads in the original game…who knew?)Those options aren’t that useful, and would only convolute the tech system. I bet we could come up with 6-12 techs that affect useful units or production, and then sort out a fair, time sensitive research method. (this way last ditch teching is really hard to do, and you wont get stuck against a super japan that will go down eventually, but not until 2 days later)I like your idea of paying an installement each turn. However, I don’t think a player should get to pick ONE tech to research for. There should be a little uncertainty, but it should be categorized. That way if you really want Heavies and have a lot of bombers, Long Range is still a useful consolation prize, but there is no chance of getting super subs. I’m still confused about creating a good way to simulate time-sensitive research and give a little chance variation to the final tech received. Here are the techs that I think we should keep from my original post, plus a few additions-have any others, or replacements?

-Revised Industrial Tech
-Future Research is somehow discounted
-Super Tanks(maybe move at 3 as well?)
-Personnel Carriers
-Long Range Air
-Air Transports
-2D Heavy BMB
-Coastal Defense
*new techs
*Heavy TRN (3INF, 2INF 1 ARM)
*Radar Guided AA Guns-Each AA gun can fire at planes attacking any adjacent territories or sea zones. (Ex: BMB attacks Germany- 3 AA shots at BMB)
*something to do with navies. (i also think naval warfare should be changed in A&A, but that’s a diff topic)
*Maybe some kind of INF tech?