HR skip movement phases in first round

[Black_Elk]

So the idea is pretty simple, each player nation has a round of purchasing using the regular turn sequence and starting income before the game begins in earnest. Or put another way basically nothing moves till round 2.

On the table top this could be seen as a zero round, digitally you could think of it as a ghost round, where everyone skips past all phases except purchase/placement by player agreement.

What sort of play pattern/balance do you think this would yield?

I’m thinking maybe this could be a simple way to rebalance the games, or maybe invert them to Allied advantage.

What would you buy?

For 1942? Global? AA50? Or any of the Axis advantage boards?

Right now I was thinking the only thing that might prevent it from working as an alternative scenario would be like exploits from mass transport/air builds, but maybe it works. Any thoughts?

[Black_Elk]

In 1942 Russia could build another pair of fighters or a pair of strategic bombers. Wondering if that might be enough to back down an all out Sea Lion play by Germany (where they try to max transports to take England on G2)? If a Russian air build can deter an easy Sea Lion and at least make it too dicey, then I think you might have an interesting game there, since G would have to consider surface ships to cover vs a Soviet R1 air strike rather going all transport crazy which might be fun. If UK can afford to build a couple ships in the zero round and stack up with their remainder, and if the USA can save their Atlantic transports that’s pretty major for team Allies. Potential for KJF if Russia uses air to the Pacific?

Axis still get a build too though, so wondering how they might play it with an extra preliminary purchase?

In AA50 and especially in G40 there is a lot more going on. But still wondering how those might play too? Especially if zero round production or naval buys might be interesting for flipping the opening combat dynamic during round two on its head.

[barnee]

@Black_Elk
Yea round sitzkrieg :)

China could buy some artillery. Uk could try and save home fleet or buff egypt. Russia go mobile or turtle hard. maybe some air. Italy…yea their kinda… well…yea, maybe a sub and a mech : )
Probably best to kiss the fleet goodbye and go mobile though heh heh but if UK didn’t do anything ?

I forgot about the French. Transport and DD in the Med ? Arty in S France or boost Paris ?
My mind is wandering now and I was just getting ready to rack out lol

Ha ha be a fun twist anyway, even it doesn’t work long term. It’s nice to mix it up once in a while : )

[Black_Elk]

Hehe for sure, least it has the benefit of being simple to explain whatever the ultimate shake down on balance. If nothing else bound to be interesting for a switch up I’d think.

Seems like something that’s been proposed before, but haven’t actually seen it in operation for the more recent boards. Might be fun in a tournament just to throw everyone a curve ball

[The Pripet Martian]

I can’t speak to any game other than G40, but I’m not convinced a Zero Round of purchases would have any effect on balance, since Axis and Allies alike can spend their full compliment of IPC. That said, I really like this HR, but with a twist:

All powers make their purchases and determine new unit placement in secret, then reveal them simultaneously.

If you take it a step further and eliminate standard new unit placement restrictions, you can open the door to potentially game-changing scenarios, such as a German aircraft carrier in the Med to protect the Regia Marina from Taranto, an American “Fortress Philippines,” etc. This could be a lot of fun, and has the potential to ruin the standard G1 and J1 openings while forcing the development of new strategies on the fly.

[Imperious Leader]

If you engage such a round and the purchases were secret, Germany could do a G2 Sealion

[The Pripet Martian]

@Imperious-Leader said in HR skip movement phases in first round:

If you engage such a round and the purchases were secret, Germany could do a G2 Sealion

That’s certainly a possibility, as long as France still falls in the first round…which might not be automatic, especially if the Brits choose to reinforce Paris.

I see so many possibilities. This really could be a lot of fun. I think I’ll have to try it.

[Black_Elk]

Secret purchase might be fun on the table top, I can see some nail bitters that way haha. Digitally its a little harder to time a simultaneous reveal which is why I figured following the regular turn sequence would probably be easiest to implement there.

In the AA50 1942 scenario it can get pretty wild, since Japan has enough for 4 transports or the option to drop a factory and 2 transports, or pair of bombers and another transport, or probably a lot of other builds. But the Allies also have a few ways to bolster the Russian and British openers, and to get the USA ready to move out a bit sooner. In the AA50 1941 scenario I see Germany and Russia could stack up quite a few tanks against each other, or maybe try to tango with air depending on what G does. Japan has less money to throw around, but they’re all set to stomp anyway in 41, so least it gives the Allies a chance put a few more hitpoints in China and for the Americans to prep for a response. Saving up some of their loot for a major purchase in round 2 is also a possibility for UK/USA if they want to keep the Axis side guessing, or stack drop fleets all at once for a stronger defense, since Axis have so many starting aircraft.

In 1942.2/1942.3 I think 1 fighter 2 art 2 inf might be a nice conservative build for Russia. You could put the ground in Caucasus to ice Ukraine and have the 3rd fighter in Karelia for Sea Lion coverage just in case, but without giving up too much of the defensive edge, since you’d still have those boots on the ground down south. A little more punch each round coming from the extra fighter if it goes more traditional ground war like it probably would, and let the other Allies pick up the slack. For a more aggressive Russian opener you could put two more hitpoints into Karelia to try and snake Baltic states or Belo without it being quite so dicey, and still have enough juice to deal with the Ukraine situation. Or you could try to do like fleet killer stuff in the skies with a Red Dawn bomber play. I think it could be pretty cool.

[Black_Elk]

ps. for the sitzkrieg round :) in G40, if you did the skip phase thing for playing digitally you’d be one round closer to round 4 for the political game before combat begins in earnest, so sort of speeding things up on the timeline a little. I wonder if there’s any interesting production or base builds, or any major battle breakers that could throw things for a loop?

[The Pripet Martian]

@Black_Elk I think a Zero Round purchase in G40 offers a myriad of options for most powers. Here are just a few thoughts that come to mind:

• USSR stacks Amur (a 12 INF buy? 6 Armor? A combo?) and sweeps through Manchuria and Korea unless the Japanese fortify both.

• USA stacks the Philippines, effectively blocking Japan’s path to the Money Islands.

• Japan buys transports. If USA doesn’t fortify the Philippines, they go south. If the Money Islands are blocked, A major move to Alaska and British Columbia isn’t out of the question.

• As I stated previously, a German aircraft carrier in SZ 97 could prevent Taranto. Saving the Italian fleet changes the dynamic in the Med fairly dramatically.

• Another German option: 5 more U-boats in the Atlantic could really ruin England’s day.

That’s really just the tip of the iceberg. I’m sure there are many other great ideas out there.

[Black_Elk]

Indications from the latest Q&A would seem to confirm that A&Aonline won’t have a lot in the way of set up adjustment, at least in early access. So I’m suggesting this rule as the only thing I can think of right now to reset the playbalance in a way that will actually work with the game we get.

I still don’t know what sort of patterns would ultimately develop on balance, but at least it is a way to get something new going for a 1942.2 that strictly uses the boxed starting set up.

I imagine this only works for PvP, so not sure how they will handle solo play vs the AI.