Germany starts with 2 bombers. They need to purchase a third bomber.
The Bright Skies
-
So the result was this way because the German play didn’t commit 100% to the Moscow push. This to me sounds like a German player who couldn’t make up his mind as to whether he wanted Russia or London. That is why the game resulted in an allied victory.
Yes he is an inexperienced Axis player that this time tried to help Italy in the med, and get to the oil through that way. I am not saying that what I did will work against 100% play against Russia so succesfully, however I think I can master this strategy of Russia in the counter-attack as its defense and it will work better than just building infantry and some spare artillery.
Against Italian can openers, yes annoying, but the first turn they can really so something is turn 4 as they lag behind the Germans who are advanxing anyways. Even then it is not such a big deal, as long you keep the defense of Moscow able to withstand the mobile part of the German army. Yes when Germany only builds mech + armor and Italy also alone mech, this becomes dangerous. Any deviation from that path as Germany benefits Russia. If Germany goes 100% Russia, the other Allies should be able to make Germany pay for this.
-
Right but you had touched on the German Luftwaffe not being able to land in the territory that Germany is taking, which wouldn’t be an issue if you use Italian can openers as pointed out by Ozymandiac. I like that we are discussing some alternate strategy options for Russia, but these types of conversations only lead to a positive strategical outcome if the steps that are discussed actually take place in the game. For instance, if Germany does not make the proper advancements, or have the Italian can openers, then the strategy may work. If Germany commits to a Sea Lion attack then Russia can afford to purchase some offensive units. The entire strategy relies on Germany not being completely focused on Russia for one reason or another, and you will not be entirely aware of what Germany is doing until G3. I do think we should change the strategy name, considering we haven’t really talked about the inclusion of American bombers. This is a whole other part of the strategy that I don’t agree with. If Japan is left unchecked in the Pacific, we could foreseeabley have a quick Japanese victory. They only need 6 capitol cities, and Hawaii would be wide open. Once Japan sacks Calcutta, it would be a cake walk. Russia needs to be able to hold Moscow to save Europe, and the US needs to be able to contain Japan. I think we need to label the two strategies desperately.
Bright Skies: the US strategy of only purchasing bombers to destroy naval fleets and or devastate Europe.
Red Tide: Russian strategy of purchasing fast moving units, and artillery in an attempt to take preventative attacks against the Axis, while being able to move more quickly than standard infantry in order to relocate i both defensive and offensive means.
-
Great call, I agree! Like the name of the Red Tide also.
This topic however has been about combining the Bright Skies and the Red Tide, as both strategies without the other will not work. Russia will not be able to put pressure on Germany is USA bombers does not force this early in the game. On the contrary the heavy USA bombers against Germany can only work if combined Allied effort on the mainland manage to hold up Japan with little help from USA.
-
Can you buy a UK carrier in SA and send to Anzac for the figs to land on and help put a bit more pressure on Japan by taking that 1 extra money island for lack of US support do to Bright Skies ?
-
You could do this, however the Japanese navy would just be too much of a monster for the smaller allied force in the Pacific to deal with. I think without US help, Japan would have free reign. I would even go as far as to say that after sacking Calcutta Japan could make a move on Sydney considering they would have a formidable navy and air force left. They wouldn’t run into much opposition if the US was focused on Europe. Japan could also use the strategy that I have mentioned before called “Divine Dragon Operation #2” in which the Japanese make a push onto the African east coast resulting in a loss of IPCs for the French and British, and liberation of some Italian territories. This kind of strategy would only be made easier by the sacking of Calcutta and the lack of US navy given they do “Bright Skies”
-
When does Japan attack Singapore ? Pretty much Anzac only gets 1 NO for just 1 turn in game ever.
-
Japan can move onto Singapore after they sack Calcutta. It is not going to be a vital territory to them, because they should have the naval base in Calcutta, the Philippines, and Hong Kong, along with one in Hainan if they do the sack Calcutta strategy. Japan would be able to move somewhat leisurely through the Pacific.
-
I might open a new thread for the Japanese strategy I mentioned. I might also open one for the Red Tide strategy. I’m thinking about testing these two strategies out, and then making videos or just some lengthy articles discussing them. It is nice to extend your playbook with both the Axis and the Allies, however the #1 reason you win or lose a game is your ability to adapt to any situation and take advantage of your opponents mistakes. That being said, it is best to have a strategy planned for any specific game that you play, and adapt accordingly.
-
When discussing the bright skies tactic of USA going all in on STR bombers early I would propose a different approach.
USA is the one country that has such a large income that they can do a more ‘balanced’ approach to their builds and not focus on a turn and build just all of X.
Lets say USA gets the J2 attack on them, thus they are at full production on USA3.
Every turn spend 33-36 IPC on 3 aircraft. FTR/TAC/STR every single turn, starting on turn 1. Maybe, based on the board switch it up and go 3 STR one turn. Then 3 FTR another turn.
IF the USA is producing 3 aircarft every turn for the first 6 turns, they have produced 18 planes + what ever naval/ground you deem you need.
The USA will build up a huge air force once the critical point of the game arrives in T6-8. Now, how you disperse them across the globe is up to you and what their ‘role’ is and thus a totally different discussion.
I just think the USA is the one country that can actually allocate 33-36 IPC to air force and 20-25 IPC in navy and the rest in land units almost every turn. Granted there are times you need to go heavier on land and light on navy based on the TRS shuck plan of attack you have but you never go light in air power on your builds.
I understand that STR Bombers are the most powerful unit because of range BUT I think it is un wise to ignore the power of FTR/TAC and the roles they can play also. TAC can get up to 4 attack value and just as strong as STR bombers. Granted their role is different but I think you should not discount that ability TAC have. FTR are you best defense weapon on scrambles and defending against STR bombing. All 3 air units have a role and just going all in on one type of aircraft can get you in trouble against a good player.
-
This is part of the reason that I am not totally convinced on purchasing only bombers for the US. You need to be able to hold Japan from expanding. This doesn’t mean that I am opposed to supporting Europe. I think that this is also crucial.
-
When it comes to supporting Europe with the bright skies tactic they can do it with minimal use of force at the start of the war. USA can get onto Mororco once they can declare war with basically just their starting force. They can then move into Tunisia with ease and now Italy can be STR bombed by the USA from Africa. Also 4-6 subs from USA and or UK can totally decimate Italy in the med on convoy routes.
With a slow methodical build up of air power moving into Africa you can secure Egypt and crush italian production to the point that they can no longer “can open” for Germany. You dont have to kill off Italy, just reduce them to a rubble pile that can’t support Germany in any meaningful way on the Eastern Front. USA/UK can accomplish this goal early in the game around T4 if USA is in the war on a J1 or j2 Attack.
USA and Japan are very similar in the approach to the war since they are both naval powers. Air Power is key to their success and when they do attack 50%+ of the attacking force is usually with air power. That is why I advocate a more balance build approach build plan for the USA. Once they go into Europe they have overwhelming air power behind their small stack of land units.
Once USA can opens for UK they follow up with the land units to secure their conquest.
-
My last battle USA was purchasing bombers in first two turns. Then turn 3-4 was used for pacific fleet as German had focused on the med and convoying UK with its buys and given Russia some space. Turn 5-6 bombers again as Germany had build extra fleet to keep its Baltic fleet alive. Afterwards just bombers to make sure any Axis fleet in Europe got directly destroyed + started pounding German factories.
So USA bomber buys are dependent on the situation. Is Germany messing around? Send your bombers against Japan + start building fleet in USA3.
To make Bright Skies work, just the first two turns building bombers is enough, third if Germany has build some additional fleet or protection for the Baltic fleet.
The initial post of this thread is from my first tuning, I got some more experience and feedback in the meantime. Will update it. You don’t need full bomber buys, however getting 9 in two first turns is always worth it I think. Lets call it the Bright Skies USA opener instead or something.
Great idea to start other topics about the Red Tide + Japan strategy. This one is called Bright Skies, but has devoted more time to Red Tide, so not sure how best to call this one.
-
I will open a thread soon. To discuss these strategies is great. The different outcomes of the games using these strategies relies on the individual players on both sides of the game. It will be interesting to see these strategies implemented and tweaked into a nice refined workable strategy.
-
I will open a thread soon. To discuss these strategies is great. The different outcomes of the games using these strategies relies on the individual players on both sides of the game. It will be interesting to see these strategies implemented and tweaked into a nice refined workable strategy.
I agree, and I see think you nailed them both already some posts earlier
-
Anyone on here looking for a PBEM game? Please private message me.
Maybe Afrikakorps you could teach me your successful allies’ strategy?
-
Curious as to why fast movers G2 are so important in your opinion?
Germany has a big enough stack of infantry that USSR can’t take them down very easily and slow movers bought G2 will arrive early enough for a G7 attack on Moscow. Unless you are targeting a G6 take down, of course.
The G2 fast mover build allows you to force the Russian forces to retreat to Moscow on R4, and allows you to move adjacent to Moscow on G5. Even if this does not mean the fall of the capitol on G6, you now can head south into the oilfields and get the German economy up to healthy 70-80 range. Slow movers bought on G2 require an extra round to get to the front which means your stack is not sufficiently strong to sit next to Moscow on the critical G5. Furthermore a stack of 20+ fast movers, with air support and Italian canopeners, allows you to project so much power from the very valuable regions south of Moscow. Slow movers just play a painful dance as Allied planes reinforce a critical territory and then can redeploy instantly in response to German movements.
The German airforce is often required to reinforce the ground forces on the pivotal move. It does place them out of position for a round or two, but they can usually get back to support the Western Front on the crucial G7 when the Allies often start mounting a major invasion in France. If your timing is off even a single round, the game could be lost.
-
Anyone on here looking for a PBEM game? Please private message me.
Maybe Afrikakorps you could teach me your successful allies’ strategy?
I would love to. Also started two other forum games to test it out online. Unfortunately I don’t have the time this month and will be travelling the months after. As soon as I return I will have the time, so lets play then!
-
Hello there!
Tomorrow I am Russia, USA and China again and will use the Bright Skies + Red Tide strategy again for a third time before I get to play the Axis again. The last two games were very succesful doing this strategy.
Lessons so far:
Bright Skies: USA bomber opening (2 turns) to destroy baltic fleet
Red Tide: a combination of artillery, mechanized infantry and tanks combined with Russian geographical advantage leads to a counter-charging Russia for their defense.
By sending early USA bomber fleet to Europe map they can take out baltic fleet or force Germany to expand its fleet. Both are great for Russia and equals Germany and Russia in power.
Russia will concentrate north to save time, can attack Scandinavia but also retreat to Moscoe, however will always be ready to strike for a counter-attack. Russia will be played with hit and run, many small battles with reserves to tire out Germany.
Best defense for Russia is offense as it negates Germany greatest strength: luftwaffe. Air can strike on offense but not participate in defense.
Italy can can-open but only from turn 4 onwards, by then time has been buyed against Germany. Also USA initial fleet will destroy Italy as there is war.
Russia keeps Siberian forces in the north to work together with UK and USA to give China more time to survive. China alive means a safe eastern border for Russia and lots of saved IPC needed for the war.
-
Again the Allies returned from a convincing victory over the Axis. Especially there synergy between heavy bomber builds from USA (100% first 4 turns) worked very well again as Germany tried to keep control over the Baltic / Leningrad.
Russia build
6 art, 3 mech
3 tank, 5 mech for about 4 turns
Since turn 6 I was expanding rapidly as Germany was overwhelmed at all sides.Pacific also worked very well again, I even got to save the flying tigers to the end of the game. Lost all chinese and siberian forces but stayed alive long enough to mess up Japan plans and forced them to retreat back instead of full out UK that could therefore survive and later on counter-attack also.
Next time I am Allies and will likely do either Russia Crush or Afrika Korps.
How do you do a standard and effective Russia crush? (builds, DOW and advances?)
-
My standard full-Russia crush is simple:
G1: 6 art + 2 mech
I1: mech + tankG2: 10 fast movers (mechs+tanks) + optional
I2 DOWG3 follow Italian thrust, purchase some more fast movers
I3 choose northern routeG4: follow Italian thrust plus minor opportunistic attacks, get some more planes
I4: move next to MoscowG5: reinforce Italian stack. Bring in planes to guarantee 90+% chance of defense
I5: step down towards Caucuses unless it looks possible to capture Moscow on G6G6 and beyond: decide on options to
A) attack Moscow
B) push to Iraq
C) head towards Siberia
D) distract Allies so Japan can win.This outline can proceed at least through G5 unless you have crazy dice rolls during the first couple of rounds. You can Battlecalc it, but there is very little that Russia can do becomes fall back to Moscow. They can choose to swap units straight up with Germany, or do minor opportunistic counters, but that won’t prevent them from being trapped in Moscow obviously R5. They might be able to delay the push by a round, but at a very high cost.
You must be playing against novices who waste too much German money on fleet or homeland defense.
Suggested Topics
